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Considering switching from Audio Research to PrimaLuna, troube with VS115 amp

Hello everyone, I have question that I hope some of you either can answer or have an opinion on. Ever since I was 17, I have always wanted to own Audio Research equipment. I’m 56 now, and finally was able to fulfill my life long dream. My first acquisition was an ARC LS15 pre-amp bought here used in mint condition. I paired it with a Vincent 331MK hybrid amp also bought here used in mint condition. The resulting sound was impressive. After that, I started looking for an ARC amp I could afford. The resulting search found me an ARC VS115 amp also here in used, awesome condition. This is where my problems and my doubts started. Upon hooking up the amp to my system, a tube in the left channel arced and blew a resistor. I had to take the amp to an ARC dealer and he installed a new resistor and suggested I buy all new tubes from ARC for the amp. I did and when I got back home, I again hooked up the amp and immediately upon turning the amp on, I started to hear thumping sounds coming from my left speaker, then, two left channel output tubes started to glow a very bright orange, and then white smoke started to rise from one of the tube sockets. I immediately turned the amp off. I called the dealer and he suggested I mail the unit back to ARC. I did and I am now waiting to see what they say.

During this time, I started to search out other brands and came across one called PrimaLuna. I have watched their videos and seen them compared to ARC equipment. Their build quality seems to be superior to ARC and the reviews are over the top. I am looking at their Dialogue Premium HP amp and their Dialogue Premium pre-amp. For what they cost, considering how they are built and supposedly sound compared to units costing 3 to 4 times their price, they almost seem too good to be true. Anyway, my bubble has been burst, and in simple terms, I am considering jumping ship and going with another company instead of ARC, despite all those years of drooling and waiting.

My main question is this, is there anyone out there that either owns PrimaLuna or has had experience with the equipment and can give me their opinion on owning and using it. Then, my second question is how does PrimaLuna really compare to other high end equipment such as ARC. Kevin Deal in his videos on PrimaLuna makes a very compelling case for the equipment. In one video, he compares an ARC LS17SE to the PrimaLuna pre-amp.

My last question is in regards to my ARC VS115 amp problems. Anyone have an opinion on what is going on with my amp or a VS115 in general. For those of you who want to know what else is in my system, I am using KEF 104ab speakers, a Cambridge Azur 752BD Blu-ray player as my CD player, Morrow Audio Cables and I am considering getting the Sony HAP-Z1ES music player for my digital files.

I greatly appreciate all who take the time to comment and give their opinions. I will be glad to answer any questions you may ask or provide additional. Thanks for your help. Steve.


128x128skyhawk51
m-db's avatar
m-db
971 posts
 
Early in my earlier career as a service engineer with a brand x business machine manufacture I saw all too often the hidden and obvious affects that a simple resistor could have on even the most robustly designed printed wire boards.

The first time I saw a tube socket mounted directly to a printed wire board I had to catch myself from, well...
I can only assume there have been monumental advances in printed wire board materials and design in the past eight years.   
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ivanj
35 posts
 
PL has given you a good education and the ads are ha-ha funny. Point to point wiring for most tube equipment is almost a necessary but not sufficient indication of quality. For example, look at old JADIS gear. There the problem was poor design and totally over-stressed components. I don't know about the new stuff.

m-db is correct; his amusing assumption is incorrect as he well knows!  ARC warranties its tubes for 90 days. If one goes it usually takes out the entire PC board. Same with McIntosh and lesser brands. Look at the early McIntosh gear like the 240, the Avery Fisher gear and I think the early QUAD valve amp. 

I'd check out Baekert Labs before I bought any more tube preamps. I've heard Rogue is good too. Unlike the anointed KD, with his Schwarzwald-Reise magic tubes, I have no interest in the company nor will I in the next 72 hrs.
bthartman
34 posts
 
I've had the PrimaLuna Dialog Premium HP Integrated for an in home demo.  I agree with the others that, for the price, it's a wonderful integrated and provides the benefit of tube rolling as well as trying not just different tube manufacturers but also tube types (the demo unit I evaluated had the stock EL34 tubes).  However, I ended up deciding to go with ARC.  I was pretty set on the new LS28 preamp, when my dealer told me that another customer had traded in a REF6 (with only 280 hours on it) to move up to D'Agostino, and I got a good price on it after a side by side comparison to the LS28.

I also directly compared the new VT80 (with KT120 tubes) to a Ref75SE (KT150 tubes), and there was no comparison.  The Ref75SE was a noticeable improvement over the VT80, particularly in the lower frequencies with more definition and grip.  If you're considering a VT80, I've seen plenty of Ref75SE's on Audiogon for around the same price as a new VT80.  The only downside to the ARC amp is that you can't try different tube types, and nor can you switch to triode mode.
johnsonwu
469 posts
 
Resistor blowing due to a runaway tube (age or mfg defect) is a common problem. Unless you have VAC phis that have thermal tube sentry circuit you will always run into it. Nothing wrong with audio Research. Just ignore what most people say and replace ONE defective tube. 
andrei_nz
192 posts
 
Skyhawk - you situation reads more like bad luck to me.  ARC are supposed to be great.  I have only heard bits and pieces of ARC and PL in other systems so cannot really comment.  However in a few weeks I will get to hear a PL Dialogue Premium in my own system and my be able to offer an opinion then.  As for Kevin Deal.  My only experience is posting on his website, or rather attempting to post, an opinion on some tubes I had bought.  It was not consistent with with other gushing experiences.  It did not get put up.

I rather like the comment of another poster (nkonor) who suggests tube pre and SS Power. I have gone that route too. With 6H30 tubes in in the Pre that is all the tubiness you are likely to need.
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