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Vintage DIN phono cables, any good?

The question is about old DIN tonearm phono cables for the top of the line vintage Japanese tonearms. 
I wonder how good those old cables are compared to the mid priced new cables ?

For example an old Audio Craft, SAEC, Fidelity Research, SONY  cables made for their top of the line tonearms are good? It's easy to replace an old RCA connectors, but what about the cables? Some of them are silver and must be a good quality. 

Any thoughts? 
Thanks 
128x128chakster
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 

Dear chakster, I am not Frank but guess that the price difference

between Neutric and Eichman is the reason. One usually don't

ask his butcher about the quality of his meat. There is even a

Dutch saying about this: ''the bucher should not value his own meat''.

But why should you refer to others? You have your own ears.

The fact that your hands are not ''born'' for soldering ''art '' you

can't ascribe to Eichmann. Anyway if one looks at both kinds one

can easylly see the opposite philosophy of their making: one point

ground and thrifty use of metal by Eichmann and the opposite by

Hhadow. Read the first post by Lew about this ''philosophy'' and

wonder about his last post . I think that he never considered carrer

in diplomacy. Even with Raul he keeps friendly relation. This is,

alas, not given to us the ordinary humans (grin).

chakster's avatar
chakster OP
6,144 posts
 
I don't think that 10 euro price difference is important:
Neutrik ProFi - 20 euro pair (retail)
KLE Copper Harmony - 30 euro pair (retail)  

I think the quality should be the most important for cable designer, not the minor price difference. In other words if Signal Cable Company taking care about the quality and uses different connectors in newer products, then it must be equal of better. Even if the well known Neutrik Proffessional connectors are equal to plastic Eichman then it ruins the theory of superiority of advanced Eichman plastic design over the traditional metal connectors. Or the designer just downgrade his products to sell more (hard to believe).

I have asked Frank about possibility of using different connectors (i could supply connectors by post), but he said he only sells what's on the website (standard or neutrik, no more Eichman).  

When i asked Chris Sommovigo to change standard connectors on one of my old Stereolab cables (designed by him), he said he could solder whatever connector i want if i will supply them. I was going to ship Xhadow to him by post (pretending it's the best rca), but instead he offered me his new LoveCraft RCA (for free) and said it's even better, but i had a choise. This is what i call customer service!   

P.S. I don't ask butchers for anything, i'm vegetarian
dover
2,250 posts
 
Chakster/Nandric -
I have used the Neutrik Profi - they are garbage in terms of sound quality - I have a bagful to prove it. The newer range of Klei are a new design and better than the earlier Eichmann bullets. The Klei and WBTNextgen are both good sound wise, and I have used them. Nevertheless I prefer a vintage plug from the 80’s, lightweight, minimal metal and robust.

With regard to the WBT’s - one of my preamps had Nextgen chassis mount RCA male sockets - the surface coating has long gone, whereas the other RCA’s for the other inputs are still like new. I question their longevity.
PS I used to distribute WBT’s in the 80’s and their quality control at the time was appalling.The centre pins on the original RCA’s were very short and on many top end components the WBTs could not actually make proper contact.

The Eichmann chassis mount RCA male sockets I have installed on my Marantz tube pre - they are ok sound wise, but no better than the original teflon/gold I had installed 25 years ago.

As far as cartridge pins go - the Cardas etc are garbage. I prefer sonically cartridge pins that are phosphor bronze base rather than the tinny brass used by most, including name brands.

Best connectors are copper or silver body ( no brass ) and minimal metal and non internal joints. If you are in the habit of melting Eichmanns or Klei’s then I suggest you go to soldering school and learn how to solder properly.

I have no experience with the Xhadow apart from 1 pair of interconnects, which, after about 4-5 years, the connector surfaces were tarnished to eternity. Not very impressive on the longevity front, given the cost..


chakster's avatar
chakster OP
6,144 posts
 
@dover 

Nevertheless I prefer a vintage plug from the 80’s, lightweight, minimal metal and robust.

That's interesting! Which one, i'd love to see the images if possible. 
And what do you think about vintage phono cables? 

If you are in the habit of melting Eichmanns or Klei’s then I suggest you go to soldering school and learn how to solder properly.

Haha, definitely not in the habit, but i'm in my school here on audiogon. 

 
I have no experience with the Xhadow apart from 1 pair of interconnects, which, after about 4-5 years, the connector surfaces were tarnished to eternity. Not very impressive on the longevity front, given the cost..

I use my Stereovox Colibru RCA (Xhadow) for 15 years, still very impressivle cable, but the connectors are not like new in color, same with Xhadow Spades on my Stereovox Firebird speaker cables.  
nandric's avatar
nandric
4,086 posts
 

Dear dover, I quote from  Lew's post ( 06-27-017) :'' I have been

using the Eichmann silver bullets, etc. ''because I see a sound

philosophy behind their design''. I refered to this philosophy

as ''one point ground'' and ''as less metal as posible''. I also

assume that the plastic body has the same function as isolation

of the wire in front of the connector. Lew  obviously changed his

mind about the ''desing philosophy'' by his later praise of the

Xhadow which design philosophy  is totally different (aka ''abundance

of metal''). This was my reason to assume his diplomatic

capabilities (grin).

Can you explain in technical terms why ''one point ground'' and

''sparing use of metal'' is important? If the plastic body instead

of metal body is also important please explain. I need this to

convince chakster: ''not a goat but an eagle ''.

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