VPI 2nd Pivot for 3D

The many versions of VPI arms that can use pivot damping fluid are very stable, and have no wobble.

I have heard the 3D arms, and they have nothing over a properly setup metal VPI arm, IMO!

The 3D arms look cheap!

The new second pivot "supposed improvement" is simply "expectation" bias - nothing to shoot out about.

stringreen is a long time VPI shill!

I like VPI, but I am not "mad" about all their newer products.

Don - you do not know what you’re talking about. I’m sure you are not a VPI fan, but if you don’t know what truth is, you shouldn’t post to steer subscribers in the wrong direction. Damping fluid in the metal VPI arms can be useful if you want to tune out a wart in your speakers, etc....in truth the damping fluid in a high end system reveals a closing in of the soundstage. Even with the damping fluid, the metal arms wobble.The metal VPI arms are very good, but the 3D’s are exceptional....ranking with the very best, even if they too wobble. If the look of the 3D is not pleasing, you can always glue diamonds to it....if the arm breaks, there is the VPI team that will readily repair/replace the arm. The 2nd pivot on the already excellent 3D that does not wobble,will make you want to re-listen to your records. I am a long time purchaser of VPI. I have a Supersoutmaster/rim drive/SDS/3D/2nd pivot. I even have one of their black VPI polo shirts that Harry sent me after helping me with an issue.

Dear @moonglum /friends: Torsianally stable?,  any tonearm suffers from that torional huge forces but the unipivots are where affects in the worst way to that very hard cartridge job.

In any cartridge mounted in any unipivot tonearm design combination first than all puts the " possibilities " to be nearest to the recording really far away.

That item combination is more an acrobatic act  that a listening experience. Unfortunatelly, that acrobatic act is made it with no real success.

We only have to think the total unstability that persé has any cartridge that rides through that very tyny stylus tip dimension and at the other extreme ( unipivots. ) side an inverted " stylus tip " that function as the pivot.
It's imposible to have any kind of stability in between, a stability that's a must to have for the cartridges can makes its job.
Even in static way an with the stylus tip in the LP with the TT spining exist no real stability. Imagine when in true motion ridding those grooves with all those  huge ( every direction ) generated forces ! ! ! 

Remember that I'm talking on what we like when listening to unipivots.

Btw, damping can't disappear the unstabilities at microscopic stylus tip as pointed out Don.

Even, in the VPI case, its design comes not caring very seriously about the needs for anti-skate.

I think that unipivots were and are designed because are easy to design, manufacturer and assembly. Additional comes with low market price. Well not so in the price subject when exist unipivots over 20K and there are audiophiles willing to own it ! ! ! Incredible.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.

Raul.... I believe you are correct....that's why the 2nd pivot works so well. ...as to why the unipivots work as well as they do ....if one looks at a bautiful phonograph....even though it is clear and clean, when looking very closely, you'll see that it is made of many dots that all meld as one into that picture.  Many listeners will be very happy with a unipivot on their turntable (I was)....but as you said...in finding and eliminating "possibilities" ..looking for the very best that can be done....the 2nd pivot brings us very much closer to the performance. That 2nd pivot increases dynamic range, widens  and deepens the stereo image, solidifies the low end, stabilizes the images within the sound field, et al.  I'm sure in the future, there will be even more modifications and applied engineering to bring tonearm designs to increased abilities, but for the moment, satisfaction can be found for most people.

   "any tonearm suffers from that torional huge forces but the unipivots are where affects in the worst way to that very hard cartridge job."

Raul I can easily see why you promote this belief because how can you have stability when the stylus is lurching from ambient temperature to something hot enough to melt vinyl and then resorts to freezing temperatures as you claimed earlier? Naturally the expansion/contraction/expansion of the pickup arm as it dissipates this extreme heat and cold must be continually expanding and contracting and expanding and contracting and expanding and contracting and so there can be no stability at all by your reasoning! Also, the "infinitely" tiny stylus combined with the "infinite" tracking force you mentioned earlier must also introduce instability because of the constantly shifting "huge" forces that are twisting the arm! It is amazing any tonearm works at all given all of the extreme forces you imagine are happening with all tonearms! What is the remedy for this Raul weren't you going to invent the ideal tonearm what happened to that effort of yours or are you still struggling with those "infinite" forces? Do please answer we all want to know I think about your efforts in this regard to achieve the perfect way to compensate for thehuge infinite forces.