2. amps-preamps
  3. 130671-3105

Sonic qualities of SET output tubes?

Can you readily identify a 300B, 2A3, 805, 211, etc., amp’s sound with your eyes closed most of the time?


If so, I’sure would like to hear from you.


Amplifier design and the technology utilized within its confines decides the ‘voice’ or influence it will yield as much or more so than merely the output tubes the designer has chosen to use.


I get that part emphatically. One must hear the amp regardless the type of output tube technology on hand.


And yes, some Pentodes and Tetrodes are used as Triodes but are not indeed triodes by their specific architecture. That’s OK, just focus on their use as Triodes herein, please.


There are however certain tube types, irrespective of vintage which have basic undeniable sonic colors or characteristics, apart from their electrical aspects which keep attracting people to amps which use this or that tube in its output stage.


Some love 211s. some adore 300Bs. Some love EL34s configured to run as Triodes. I have an affinity for the latter. So far anyway. This topic could change my mind.


Has your own experience informed you what this or that output tube’s natural flavor regularly announces itself to be so you can have a reasonable expectation of its general presentation?


What sonic attribute continually attracts you to a particular SET tube design, 300B or some others?


Or, conversely, what is it about the sound that would bring you to covet a 211 amp over a 2A3, for example.


Why as another example, would you pick a 2A3 amp over one using 805s or 300B, 211, etc. or vice versa?


Removing ‘vintages’ and electronic or electrical qualities from the argument, what sonic attributes for the more popular S.E.T. amp output tubes have you determined seem to persist in their particular DNA?


I’m asking for input from those SET tube devotees to lend their experiences and knowledge on the subject of what tube sounds like what irrespective of the SET application, generally speaking.


My goal is to try getting a better feel for which SET Tube amp design, if any, I’d want to pursue and possibly invest heavily into going forward as the soul of a new system.


Tremendous thanks to all!

blindjim
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,533 posts
 
Thor TPA 30s.   Great, great amps. First Watt M2 smooth and warm. Neither had enough omph when at times. 

Then an I got some TRL Samson monoblock amps and things just opened up with no more sense of tentative or nervous sound. These were 200 watt SS monoblock amps that are spectacular.  Little known gems.   

Think I recall this rightly, but it has been some time now.  
brownsfan
1,508 posts
 
I own the Coincident Super Victory IIs, which are a little less efficient (92.5dB) that the Total Victorys.   I never really got the Supers to sing with the Coincident Frankensteins.   I decided to give Atmasphere M-60s a try, and I am extremely pleased with the combo.  They have been in service for about 6 months now, and I have no inclination to reinstall the Franks.  My room is not large, 19 x 15 x 8.  The Franks just couldn't do it in that room with those speakers, and as Ralph has pointed out, distortion got high enough to really be objectionable with any volume at all.  I was very patient with trying to get the Franks to work with the Super Victorys, having found that they were just sublime with my Coincident Triumph Extreme II monitors. Especially with the Elrog 300Bs (don't get me started).   I have heard the Franks drive the 94dB PRE's, and I did not sense that the Franks were struggling at all with the PREs.     Charles loves the Total Victory/Frankinstein duo, Bill not so much.  I almost think one is going to have to A/B to choose between an SET and an OTL.   
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 

Hi Bill (Grannyring),

You had the Coincident Total Victory II(TV) and I have the Total Eclise II. Although the TV is rated as 97 db sensitive and the TE 94db people familiar with both say the TE is actually easier to drive. Could be the simpler design and crossover and the 14 ohm impedance.


I have driven my TE with three amplifiers

100 watt PP 6550/KT 88 tube

40 watt PP el 34

8 watt 300b SET

The 100 watt amplifier has more bass weight and impact driving the TE.

All three of these amplifiers sound "really" good with these speakers.


Overall the SET is the best of this fine group.

Tone, timbre harmonic overtones, openness, transparency, tactile presence, 3 dimensional presentation, nuance and sheer emotional connection. I could go on but I believe you see my point. I’ve have this combination for 8 ears and if anything the SET impresses me more as time passes. It has a naturalness and purity of sound the two fine PP amps can’t equal.


What the SET excels at are the qualities that matter most to me. I understand the desire others here express for power. Do what pleases you and makes you happy. Head to head comparisons in my system the 8 watt 300b SET is superior in music reproduction over my 100 watt PP amplifier.


As has been said before low power SETs are not for everyone and I agree with this observation. No type of amplifier will do everything flawlessly so we choose our compromises.


When I consider all the musical and sonic parameters that are crucial for my enjoyment the 8 watt SET has been superior in my system. For others perhaps not. For point of reference I prefer both of my PP tube amps over my prior Symphonic Line transistor amplifier.

Charles

charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 

Hi Bill (Brownsfan)

It's so good to see you posting again as I always appreciate your insight. I do believe that the Total Eclipse and your Triumph are easier to drive than your SV II speakers. I'll admit that you listen to more demanding music more often than I do as another factor. I'm a jazz guy and you're classical. I very happy to read that the Atma-Sphere mono blocks are just a better fit for your needs. The Frankenste
in and TE

grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,533 posts
 
 Charles, no doubt your speakers are much easier to drive then my old TVll's.  Your speakers do not show up used very often, if at all. I used to look for them a couple of years ago. 
More to discover