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Elrog 300b's for sale. Your thoughts?

I noticed this morning an add for the new Elrogs.   I and many others on the forum ran the experiment when the Elrogs were initially launched.   We found the tubes to be superb sonically, but woefully unreliable.  In fact, the early failure rate on those tubes was apparently 100%.  I and others received replacements that were hand selected for suitability in our particular amps.  In fact one individual had 3 pairs fail.  In my case, I went so far as to purchase a PS audio power plant, having been assured that limiting incoming voltage to 115V would ensure reasonable lifetime for the Elrogs.  Two days ago, one of my replacements failed, after having been nursed along carefully.  Honestly, I doubt the tubes had 600 hours on them.  So the Psvane T1s went back in and I began the period of mourning for my deceased Elrogs.  This morning I awake to the siren song of an ad from a reputable dealer who is announcing availability of the new improved Elrogs with a 1 year warranty.   My initial reaction was, "I don't think so.  Someone else can run the $1200 experiment.  Burned once and lesson learned."  But here is the problem.  If all of Elrogs former customers take that approach, the new Elrog will also fail even if the tubes are good for 10000 hours, simply because no one will buy them.    The tubes are so good that it would be a tragedy if that happened.  So the question to all of you who have already been down this road is this?  What would it take for you to give these tubes a try again?
brownsfan
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,236 posts
 
Hi jacarcopo,
I glad to hear that the current Elrogs are seemingly more durable compared to the earlier versions I had. Despite our different Amplifiers/audio systems I find our listening impressions virtually identical. Yes I’d say that the Elrog is just a little bit smoother, warmer and organic in presentation. The EML XLS is more dynamic and authoritative yet retains an organic character  and is by no means a "cool" sonic presentation IMO.

The XLS is as you note very robust and well built. There are reports that early versions of this tube are approaching 40,000 hours of use and yet still are able to test as new. By any standard this is impressive! I did enjoy the Elrog in my Coincident Frankenstein amplifier but honestly I don’t feel as though I’ve lost anything with the EML XLS (Just subtle differences and tradeoffs) . At this juncture I’m very pleased with them and don’t anticipate a tube change.

The XLS isn’t inexpensive itself but does offer excellent sound quality and apparently extraordinary lifespan/ reliability. After over 3 years of heavy near daily use mine tested exactly the same as the day I got them.
Charles
brownsfan OP
1,508 posts
 
Jacarcopo,  Thanks for posting this report.  I've exercised considerable discipline in waiting things out for a year before making a decision on Elrog vs EML XLS to replace my Psvane Ts.   Much as I loved my Elrogs, I just can't get to a justification for taking that risk again, and even if the reliability issue has been solved, I'm not hearing either you or Charles reporting a huge separation in purely sonic terms.  Hopefully, I'll get around to this before a tariff on vacuum tubes is imposed. ;>)
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,236 posts
 
Hi Bill,
It good see a post from you, it reminds me of the of the good old days on this forum 😊. To be fair you just might find the Elrog superior and may prefer it based on your own comparison. The Elrog certainly is a excellent sounding tube with its undeniable strengths. You could find the gap between the Elrog and EML XLS perhaps a bit wider than jcarcopo or myself.

As I wrote above when all is considered sonically across the full spectrum the XLS does acquit itself very well.Bill some say that the Psvane W.E Replica 300b is an excellent tube and probably a bit more organic and midrange centric relative to the EML XLS.

I don’t envision Elrog (or any tube manufacturer) producing a surplus of their tubes and dumping them here at ultra low cost, so I believe we’re safe from tariffs 😊😊.
Charles
brownsfan OP
1,508 posts
 
Charles, I'm sure the EML is going to be just fine.  Its been a year since my 2nd set of Elrogs burned out.  That should be enough time that a comparison of the Elrogs and EMLs from me will be meaningless.   Over the years I've learned that we seem to hear the same things, and value the same things, so I have no inclination to run a very expensive experiment to ensure that that still holds true.   I do think that the Elrog design offers much to recommend itself, and I want them to succeed and continue to roll out new products.   But, they got off to a rough start, and I suspect they are going to have to offer something better than diminishing returns at premium prices to fully realize their potential as a company.   BTW, I am really enjoying the Franks in the downstairs system.   Nice having the luxury of a good SET system and a good OTL system based on the M-60's.  
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,236 posts
 
Bill,
Well you do have 2 very fine audio systems to enjoy when some struggle to develop just one. Of course you know how I value your listening impressions and perspectives. What are the essential differences (If any) you hear between the 2 systems playing the same music. I realize that one uses full range speakers (Super Victory) and the other monitors on stands (Triumph Extreme). If must be quite nice to have both a first rate SET mono blocks and OTL mono block amplifiers for enjoying your classical music library. Have you tried the M 60s with the Triumph Extremes?
Charles
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