subwoofers and panels don't mix

What about the Wilson Benesch Torus "infrasonic generator?"

I have yet to hear them, but from what I understand the push pull design and extremely low mass (half an ounce) of the 18" driver supposedly makes it extremely fast, and would seem like a perfect match for stats.

Can anyone comment on them?

You would need a massive BLH sub. Or 2 stay clear of klipsch w bin yuck. Or maybe consider a 31.5 in super woofer in ported cabinet. The Fostex 31.5 in was amazing transient reponce very low excursions massive cone area so matchs up great with planars or stats.

Somewhat further OT here:

NHT's lifestyle "woofer" system is being closed out at Audio Advisor (I get their mailers) @ $300 per. This isn't really a "subwoofer", but it puts two 10" drivers in a very slim sealed box (app 6" deep) with IIRC a 200 watt amplifier. Max extension is something like 38hz @ unspecified spl/unspecified THD.

Observation: Since the narrow cabinet puts the front of the woofer 6" from the wall, cancellation effects should be minimal.

Observation 2: Max excursion of the drivers is unspecified, but can (presumably) be limited by employing multiple units in the room.

Question: If you scatter 4 - 6 of these units in your room ($1200 to $1800) how do you suppose performance would compare with conventional subs in the price range?

I'm not in the market, but the question crossed my mind and I wonder what you guys think.

Marty

Soundlabs are reviewed as having very good realistic bass, so a sub should not be necessary.
However before I got the Soundlabs I was going to try out a Klipschorn bass unit that I managed to get hold of - my theory is that it would make the ideal sub

I agree with Johnk - stay away from bass bins - far away.

Gordon Holt used Soundlabs (very fast) for many years before switching to ATC speakers (fast with panel-like mids and more dynamics). An 0.1/15 ATC sub will probably integrate with panels as good as if not better than most anything else - only problem is they are $7K which is like twice what a good JL subwoofer costs. If budget constrains you then check out a JL F112 first and see how that sounds (it is great value for a tight/fast sub).

On another point - how would you stop the bass from a poweful sub (like a JL or ATC) from interfering with the panels - surely the giant panel surfaces will be influenced by the air vibrations in the room. What I mean is this - when I play music loud then I can feel all the surfaces vibrating as they respond to airborne LF vibrations. Obviously a woofer with a huge magnet will be tightly controlled and remain unaffected - this is unlikley to be th case for a huge surface area of a panel in a relatively weak force field.

Hey guys, I ran across some interesting developments here and thought they might bear out on what we are discussing.

Hsu has a new subwoofer (not so new now, but newer than the latest post above) and it might help us with panel integration. It is called the VTF-15H and while it is a bit bigger than my VTF3-HO (11.5 inch woofer vs 15) that is not in particular what I care about.

It has a 'sealed mode' (meaning --> quick/fast) *and* it has extensive tunability features that may make it so we can tune it to a more panel-friendly state. I will not be acquiring one anytime soon :), so someone else who owns one or who can somehow borrow one and who has 1.7/3.6/etc. will have to test if they feel so inclined, but this looks very promising.

It has an alterable Q Factor, as well as an alterable EQ. Well, anyhow, I'll just let this owner explain it:

http://forum.hsuresearch.com/showpost.php?p=78790&postcount=88

(Please do read that - that is the point of this post.)

And here is a professional review:

http://www.hometheater.com/content/hsu-vtf-15h-subwoofer

So, will this help? It very well could be!!

I'd love it if someone who really knows subs could read all the literature on the tune-ability of it and comment - maybe it is all just eq, or maybe it can change other properties of the sound to make it blend with panels better. And the sealed mode will help, someone mentioned that above - the VTF-3HO that I have doesn't do that, but this new one does.

And - I think we are a funny group, crossing over at 45 Hz (at least for 3.6/3.7 owners), so our sub needs are different than most. I think what this newer sub can do if you are crossing over at 70 or 80 will definitely be very very significant (1.6/1.7, other lower-bass e-stat owners)!