High End is Dead?

Ghasley, you have 00’s of posts registered here, it is you that possibly needs some more sunshine, please leave others alone who are just posting their facts and realities.

Also, you are incorrect about systems being cheaper today, a 1962 system from a specialty manufacturer isn’t relevant as there were few, move to 1975 where there was a base of specialty audio companies to make a fair comparison. Back then, 67% of families owned their home on a single family average income of $15k, a top line stereo back then was about $3k. Today the average household income is $72k with both parents working and a top range system is closer to $100k. Your numbers are flawed if you look at what you would have got in 75’ vs. today. You were buying the top of the line units back then, top of the line today would set you back over a million!

Russbutton, great perspective, and very true! Aligns with my thoughts too!

I live in the San Francisco Bay Area and we have a lot of dynamics which are affecting the high-end market. That $72k average household income does not go very far here. The high cost of living means that people have less disposable income. Here are a couple of recent examples (and, unfortunately, these stories no longer surprise those of us who live here):

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/04/19/burned-shell-of-a-home-sells-for-more-than-900000-in-san-jose...

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/04/16/condemned-house-sells-for-1-2-million-fremont/

Also, because of the cost of living, it’s not unheard of people have 2 hour commutes to work. Once they get to work, most people are working extended hours to keep up with their peers and also avoid peak commuting traffic. Those who choose to live closer to employment centers typically have less space to accommodate a large audio system and have shared walls which limit the volume at which you can play a system.

Time for shopping is also compromised. If you go to brick and mortar retails stores or malls, you don’t see a lot of shoppers walking around. People tend to buy online (convenience) and try to save money (comparison shop, free shipping and no tax).

One thing we do have is nice weather and plenty of ways to enjoy it. On weekends, a lot people tend to go outside and pursue some other activity. The roads and trails are filled with bikers and hikers, and parks are busy with people playing soccer and baseball or just lounging on grass enjoying the weather.

All this equates to less time, money and desire to buy a high-end system. The premium is on low cost, convenience and portability. The result is that a store that opened in 1950 just closed a couple of weeks ago and would not be surprised if others are close behind.

@gnaudio thanks for your input. Your three posts in total with all three on this thread give you a great deal of credibility. We have two issues here, first issue is that the OP and his alter ego (you) are trolls and again, I cant for the life of me figure out what jollies one gets out of trolling.

The second issue is the adoption of audio as a hobby, in what form and are the costs reasonable. As @theothergreg so wisely points out, people live differently and spend their money differently but nonetheless, virtually everyone has the means to consume music in their own way. Yesterdays transistor radio and home hifi set evolved into the more limited home hifi and expanded car audio set. Today, virtually everyone can consume music and enjoy reasonable fidelity. Smartphones are not a bad entry point for most and for many, its enough. The idea that a high fidelity system has to look like a rack system and the more pieces of gear the better is no longer a valid data point. Physical spaces used to be required for the exchange of knowledge and for hifi, that used to mean the dealers physical location was the forum. People dropped by and talked, demoed, listened and gained knowledge through the process. Today that happens in the virtual world and its only natural that the purchasing cycle follows suit.

All of those people that @theothergreg mentioned who are out enjoying the outdoors are also carrying with them the ability to listen to music and more than likely have virtually every music title at their fingertips. Thats a concept that no one dreamed of just 20 years ago. I still remember the boombox and what a craze the mixtape became. Then comes hip hop and the recent Pulitzer prize awarded Kendrick Lamar. Things change, they expand and contract but mourning that consumers are consuming music differently than they once did in the past doesnt make a whole lot of sense in an historical perspective.

Owning a home or not only changes the required form factor for musical reproduction and you cant get more portable than a smartphone and a pair of phones. Also, people are and should be more portable today. San Francisco IS expensive. Silicon Valley IS expensive. Central Park West IS expensive. Certain places always have been and always will be. People will eventually move their businesses and their lives to places that are less so because it will make sense. Look at the migrations taking place among those capable of earning their livings anyplace...Detroit, there are plenty of examples.

In summary, the consumption of music drives the form factor and if you yearn for a large shrine to the audio systems of old, those days arent coming back. The world is virtual and the dealers and audio markets are too. Thats not going to change, its going to accellerate.

I am fine with the question "Is high end dead?"  I don't think the poster is picking a fight, but is making a point with his question.

For me, this is the time of building my nice system.  But, it took me until I was 55 before I could afford to do it, and even with that, I tend to buy used or demo gear.  Otherwise, I would not be able to afford anywhere near as nice of a system.

I like tube amps (and preamps) and vinyl-- even with it's associated quirks and maintenance.  But, most of my friends can't even contemplate a $1,600 turntable, let alone a $1,600  machine to clean records.  I think high end audio is  kind of a solo, self-indulgent hobby, which makes it inherently a small demographic group.  Couple that with the time we have available to actually listen to music, and it's no surprise that audiophiles tend to be nearly all old guys.

Anyway, I like this forum, have developed some friendships from it, and have received lots of help from the more experienced folks who participate.  They have kept me from making expensive, disastrous gear decisions, and have nudged me in the right direction.  So, I'm good.  Thanks.