Beware the audio guru


There are a few contributors to these forums who apparently see themselves as gurus. They speak in absolutes, using words such as "always" and "never." They make pronouncements about products or techniques they’ve never heard or experienced, justifying their conclusions because contrary claims are "impossible" or "snake oil." Those who disagree are accused of being "deluded," or suffering some insurmountable bias, or attempting to further some commercial agenda. On occasion, they have taunted detractors with an appeal that they engage in a wager - one guy wanted $25,000 cash up front and an agreement drafted by lawyers. Another offered 5-to-1 odds.

I am not going to tell you who to believe. But for anyone who might be uncertain about sorting out conflicting claims here, I suggest they consider the behavior of experts in other fields. No good doctor offers a 100 percent guarantee on any treatment or surgical procedure, even if medical science suggests success. No good attorney will tell you that you have a case that positively can’t be lost, even if the law appears to be on your side. No true professional will insult you for the questions you ask, or abandon you if you seek a second opinion.

A doctor conducts his own tests. An engineer makes his own measurements. Neither will insist the burden of documentation falls upon you.

These might be details to consider as you sift through the many conflicting claims made on Audiogon. In short: Decide for yourself. Don’t let other people tell you how to think, or listen.
Ag insider logo xs@2xcleeds
I have an old former surfer friend (he was a friend in to 60s, and not since) who's an "actual" guru in Hawaii. Lots of followers, and it's been interesting to see his strange guru path..smart guy, formerly great surfer...it's all too weird. 

You can learn from other people by the way, and to dismiss that fact is odd, but experience and some logic can often make you less susceptible to hyperbole and agenda based falsehood.
wolf_garcia
I have an old former surfer friend (he was a friend in to 60s, and not since) who’s an "actual" guru in Hawaii. Lots of followers, and it’s been interesting to see his strange guru path..smart guy, formerly great surfer...it’s all too weird.

>>>>>Dude! It wasn’t Uncle Stu, was it? Uncle Stu (RIP) posted over on AA mostly Tweakers Asylum for many years.

You can learn from other people by the way, and to dismiss that fact is odd, but experience and some logic can often make you less susceptible to hyperbole and agenda based falsehood.

>>>>Yes, people can learn, if they they are capable of learning, which I find many people actually aren’t. I guess that’s the way the cookie crumbles. 🍪

Only quote facts. - old audio expression
"There are a few contributors to these forums who apparently see themselves as gurus. They speak in absolutes, using words such as "always" and "never." They make pronouncements about products or techniques they’ve never heard or experienced, justifying their conclusions because contrary claims are "impossible" or "snake oil.""


Hmmm...I smell the whiff of a strawman, so I hope you could give some more detail because of course I could be wrong.

I’ve read, and been involved in, a number of threads in which some people are voicing skepticism against other people defending some high end audio claim.

But I don’t recall many...or even any...people speaking in the absolutist terms you are writing about. (Certainly that wouldn’t apply to me even when I’m being skeptical).

Admittedly I may have missed such posters, or perhaps forgotten someone making such absolute negative claims. But I’d like to actually see an example or two. (These days I don’t just take someone’s word on what a skeptic may have argued, because I see skeptical arguments, mine very often, continually depicted inaccurately on this forum...)

No true professional will insult you for the questions you ask, or abandon you if you seek a second opinion.


I couldn’t agree more strongly!

And that of course goes for anyone who is seen as, or presents himself/herself as a "guru" making claims for a product, tweak, or just dispensing high end audio "wisdom." Generally speaking: beware gurus!

In short: Decide for yourself. Don’t let other people tell you how to think, or listen.


Absolutely. But on the other hand, don’t go overboard with that attitude to another form of close-mindedness: "nobody can tell me anything, I have my own opinions!" We want to remain open to information or arguments others may make, so we can modify our beliefs if warranted. Agreed?

*(And, again, I don’t know that I’ve actually seen anyone here telling other people "how to think, or listen.")


IMO, after reading some of the posts here, the thread should have been titled "Beware the Blowhards".

Dave
prof
... I don’t recall many...or even any...people speaking in the absolutist terms you are writing about ... But I’d like to actually see an example or two ...
If you keep reading the forums, I'm confident you'll recognize those who speak in absolute terms.  I'm not going to single anyone out beyond what I did in the original post.