Best MM?

Modern MM cartridges for $2000 indicates how much modern manufacturers (ClearAudio) would like to earn on the sales by using cartridge generator made by Audio-Technica.

In fact, for a brand new MM, $2k is ridiculous price as the MM cartridges always were much cheaper than MC. And it should be cheaper, it’s different technology. Only in this crazy world where LOMC cost up to $15k the $2k MM looks cheaper, lol . 

It would be nice to explain in details which vintage MM/MI were beaten by that modern MM $2k cartridges ? I want to know the reference in MM category for the users of modern MM stuff.

My reference is Audio-Technica AT-ML180, Stanton SC-100 WOS, Glanz MFG-61, Victor X-1II, Grace LEVEL II BR/MR and Pioneer PC-1000 mkII. In my opinion these cartridges are unbeatable by any modern MM and much more reasonable priced on the used market. All these are highly competitive with $5k modern LOMC. in my opinion.

Again, in my opinion the real gems are on the vintage market.

Chakster, I recall seeing Stanton and Pickering on Jukeboxes in the days of old. Yes they were very good, but I don't recall seeing anybody sitting in front of a Jukebox trying to dial in a sound stage.

I get a 3D holographic sound stage with my Grado Master 2 cartridge. I don't recall anyone even mentioning "sound stage" in the "Golden Age" as you refer to it.

I have discovered cartridges to be highly competitive in regard to price; meaning that if the Clearaudio doesn't offer $2000 worth of sound, it won't last.

While different brands have different "house sounds", people who buy them feel they have something worth the price they paid for them.

The "Chrisma" costs more than this highly regarded MC, and whoever buys it figures it's worth the price; what I'm saying, is that the market place determines the price, and how much a cartridge is worth.

lyra Argo stereo MC phono cartridge. Medium output (0.5 mV), aluminum alloy body with boron cantilever.

$1,500.00

Stanton made so many cartridges for mass market, but i am talking about high-end models like Walter O. Stanton Signature CS-100 WOS (Sapphire coated cantilever and Stereohedron tip) or 980/981 series only. Walter Stanton believed to his dying day that NO moving coil cartridge could ever be any good. He even made super low output MM like MC! Stanton’s 980 LZS cartridge to be used in stereo systems which have high gain, low impedance MC inputs or use external head amps with inputs impedance of 100 Ohms or higher. Since the output of the 980 LZS cartridhe is .06 mv /cm/sec, 20 dB minimum of additional gain is required to step up the voltage to the level of the conventional MM cartridge. The 980 LZS features extremely low dynamic tip mass (resulting in rise time of 100 micro sec.), high compliance (30cu), replaceable stylus assembly designed with samarium cobalt magnet ans Stereohedron stylus tip.

Read this interesting article first.

Price for the brand new modern cartridges means nothing, just marketing. You can put $400 Pickering XSV-3000 or Stanton 881s mkII against any super expensive modern MC and then we will see what you like the most, despite the price difference in 10 times. Many of us has stuff to compare (vintage mm cartridges vs. modern mm or mc).

P.S. Grado also made many cheap cartridges for mass market (nothing special), except some amazing top of the line models like Joseph Grado Signature XTZ, which i have and like a lot. I have not tried new wooned body Grados, but i have the one which was top of the line in the 80s (XTZ) handmade by the founder of the Grado himself (Joseph Grado, not John Grado who's his son). Joseph was proud about XTZ series.

chakster

... the founder of the Grado himself (Joseph Grado, not John Grado who's his son ...

John is not Joseph Grado's son; he is his nephew.

The "Chrisma" costs more than this highly regarded MC, and whoever buys it figures it's worth the price; what I'm saying, is that the market place determines the price, and how much a cartridge is worth.

Chakster's point is that 'the market' has simply not HEARD the performance of the really great MM cartridges from 'The Golden Age of Analogue' and is only able to compare the 'current' MM cartridges to the 'current' MC cartridges.

I have compared directly, on the same turntables with the same tonearms, cables, phonostages etc......many of the recent LOMC cartridges (VdH Grasshopper, Helikon, Titan i, Koetsu Urishi, ZYX UNIverse, XV-1s, Atlas) against not only the great MM cartridges from the 'Golden Age'.....but also the great LOMCs from the 'Golden Age' (Ortofon SPU-Ae Gold, Fidelity Research FR-7f, Sony XL-55 and XL-88, JMAS MIT-1) and I agree with Chakster.
Not only are the great vintage MM cartridges better than the current ones, they are better than any of the recent $4000-$15000 LOMC cartridges I have heard.....and so are the great vintage LOMCs.

To Chakster's list of great vintage MMs....I would add:-

• Garrott P77/SAS
  
• Victor Z1/SAS
  
• Signet TK-7LCa
  
• Signet TK-7SU
  
• Shure ML-140HE
  
• Signet MR5.0Lc
  
• Empire 4000D/III Gold
  
• Shure V15/Type III/SAS
  
• Acutex LPM420-STR
  
• Victor 4MD-1X
  
• Victor 4MD-20X
  

These great cartridges are all still available either 'used' or 'NOS' from EBay or Japan Yahoo for less than $1000 and often less than $500 and it just requires patience and persistence for anyone to acquire them.

Chakster's mission (and I admire him for it) is to point audiophiles to even better analogue sound than is available with the current 'overpriced' MC cartridges on the market.