Where are the subs?


In listening to the Bach Toccata and Fugue BMV 565, I was struck by how well the organ pedal notes are reproduced since I moved my primary setup to another room. I complemented myself on a fine job of integrating the Velodyne HGS-10 subs with the KEF Ref 1s, using 40 Hz low-pass with 24 dB/octave. But as I thought about it, I didn’t recall connecting the SMS-1 bass manager to the Ayre KX-5 Twenty preamp. I checked. The subs were not connected. The Ref 1s alone where reproducing that satisfying bass. Amazing for stand mounted monitors. I sure as hell didn’t expect that. To confirm, I played the Saint-Seans 3rd Symphony. Same result. Makes me wonder if I need bother connecting the subs.
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Very very few speakers can reach their -3db point at realistic volume at the listening position. Maybe at a foot away at very low volume. 
Hello wspohn,

     I'm just curious what source material you use that contains organ music with bass extension down to 16 Hz?

Thanks,
  Tim
I bet you are running a hefty power amplifier!  People might be surprised what their main speakers are capable of given the right power from a quality amplifier.   
In my previous system running very good dual 6-1/2" woofer ported tower speakers and 150 quality watts at 8 ohms (225 watts @ 4-ohms) and the bass slam and depth was amazing!  Absolutely no need for subwoofers which is a preferred solution IMHO. 
In summary- Power to the mains!  
Hello avanti1960,

     I agree with you in general that most good quality speakers will benefit by being fed more power from a quality amp.
     However, there's an inherent problem with attaining high quality bass response performance from a pair of tower speakers; namely that the bass, midrange and treble transducers are all fixed in position, typically in a vertical alignment.
     Most owners will position their towers in relation to their listening seat in a triangular configuration, with the speakers 6-8' apart and the listening seat placed carefully at the midpoint between the speakers with the seat positioned at varying distances away from this midpoint depending on owner preference.  The idea being this will provide optimum stereo imaging at the listening seat with the assistance of precise speaker toe-in adjustments.
     This is a fairly effective method for attaining good midrange and treble response and a good stereo sound stage image at the listening seat.  The problem is that the bass drivers cannot be independently positioned for optimum bass response at the listening seat.  This results in your statement, of "Absolutely no need for subwoofers which is the preferred solution IMHO," being an opinion that is not supported by the facts.
     The truth is the bass response performance a tower speaker user attains at his listening seat is dependent on luck.  The odds that two tower subs positioned for optimum midrange, treble and stereo imaging at the listening seat will also provide optimum bass response performance positioned in the exact same position are extremely low. 
     You should consider yourself lottery winner lucky for apparently attaining both with your tower speakers.  The moral of your experience is that you got extremely lucky. I'd suggest refraining from formulating or extrapolating any opinions beyond this fact since they will lack any value.

Tim
noble, I reluctantly gave away the KEF Ref 107/2s because I didn't want to ship them.  The floor is carpeted as is the wall behind the speakers and about 5' of the ceiling above the speakers.  It is a second floor room.  I will try to reconnect the Velodyne SMS-1 bass manager and HGS-10s tomorrow and rerun the acoustic room correction.  For now I'll leave the low-pass at 40 Hz 24 dB/octave without high-pass.  May also connect the Technics SL 1200 Mk 2 and Ayre Pxe phono stage.