Looking for a good full range floor stander


Hello all.  Making a good two way system for a 20 x 40x 12 high room budget 12k to 16 k.  Powered by a bryston 14b cubed amp.  Have a surround system with Golden ear ref and surrounds powered by parasound a21 for mains  and Carver cinema grand for surrounds. Like the GEs  The speakers I'm looking for will be for music only lots of jazz (female vocalist a fav), classical, classic rock and roll (70's and up).  I have heard good things about proac k6, Joseph audio, and a few others but am not within 4 hours of audition range.  Real interested in people in the know about the proac or suggestions.  Thanks in advance.
paliden
Oh, Martin Logans do not image any better than any other ESL or Ribbon loudspeaker. They are compromised by having to cross to a woofer usually at 250 Hz or above because the curved panel is non linear. Sanders, who designed this panel for ML abandoned it as inferior which you can read about on his web site sanderssoundsystems.com. 
As for size it all depends where you like sitting. I like being up front in the first 10 rows of a big concert and at the stage in a small venue. Point source speakers put you in the back of the hall. If you increase the volume to try and get yourself up front you get a very surreal effect of a band playing very loud at a distance. 
You have a very large space to fill with sound and you have a Bryston 14Bcubed so the power is not an issue.
If you look at the Bryston line, they have the Model T Signature speakers (which I have) and they are pretty amazing in performance with a huge amount of dynamic output.  I am using my pair in a 30x35x18 room with a pair of Anthem M1 mono's at 2000 watts per channel and it sounds outstanding.  I would seriously consider these speakers.
audiotroy2,

You must be a dealer.  When I was looking for speakers, I thought Focal, B&W and Keff's were some of the worst out there.  Focal's aria line is one of the worst (look at the reviews).  When I heard them I asked the dealer, "Where's The Bass?"  There responded Focal was the only audiophile speaker out there.  I then told him audiophiles must be allergic to bass.  I was not impressed with either B&W 804's or Diamond series.  The first thing I thought of you got to be kidding these speakers sell for $17,000 and $30,000 per pair.  You've got to be kidding me.

You must be a dealer who sells these brands?

I listened to Martin Logan Motion 60's, B&W CM10 and 804's, Golden Ear, Definitive technologies, Vienna Acoustic's, Monitor Audio Silver 8, 10 and Gold series and ended up with my Paradigm Prestige 85F's.  After purchasing them, I went back to listen to the all the B&W's and couldn't believe I liked Paradigm better.  Shortly after I purchased them an ex-friend sent me an article discussing how 3 way are better than 2 1/2 way speakers.  He turned around and purchased a pair of SALK Song Encore's at the RMAF knowing they were 3 way.  He always made sure he was one up on me and I finally came to my senses and told him to go pound sand.  I think there are a lot of snobby audiophiles that love doing this.

After this discussion, I think dealers should not be allowed to participate.  They slyly pretend to be consumers only to sell their own stuff.  

After reading your responses I would imagine many of us feel you should be banned from participating.

Just telling it like it is.  I am sure this will fire up further discussions.

If you looked at the reviews and looked at their performance numbers, they lived up to what they sounded like to me.  I always wonder why Paradigm gets left out.  They are certainly better many of their competitors in that price range.  Chris Spies is by far also one of the best manufacturer reps in the industry.  Can't find a better sales person.  He explained how they developed a corrugated material inside the cabinet walls and the 2 1/2 way cross over to make them a 93 db efficient speaker to boost an extra 3 db.  This in turn allows the Prestige series to distort music less.

SALK manufactures high end speakers with active bass woofers and they can certainly fill a room.  However, the retailers don't want to hear anything about how great SALK speakers are because Jim sells them direct so he doesn't have to sacrifice the quality of his cabinets and drivers.

I think it might be interesting for someone to lead a discussion asking those of us who are dealers.  We will then be able to put two and two together.
larry5729
audiotroy2, You must be a dealer... I think dealers should not be allowed to participate. They slyly pretend to be consumers only to sell their own stuff.  After reading your responses I would imagine many of us feel you should be banned from participating.
Please speak for yourself. Audiotroy is well known here for being a dealer - he certainly hasn't concealed that, nor does he pretend to be a customer. Dealers are welcome to participate here under Audiogon's terms of use so if you have any complaint, it is with Audiogon, not audiotroy.


Larry we say we are dealers and we have every right to be here.

As per your quip about Salks or brand x sounding better than a commercial brand a lot of dealers showrooms are not optomized for sound. Some dealers have poor soundrooms or dont sell good matching  electronics so somtimes an opinion of a product heard may not be as good as it could be.

Sorry to rain on your Salk love affair yes his speakers are a great value.

However there is only so far you can go with stock Seas drivers.

It is our feeling that the true leaders in any industry design their own parts which are usually vastly superior this requires a substantial capital investment.

Look at Rockport, YG, Magico, Paradigm, Kef, B&W, Focal there is a reason why their speakers are in the rarified air of compannies that continue to push innovation and whose products are consistantly setting the bar.

This is also why these products cost more to buy. Many large companies spend milions of dollars in R&D.

Salk falls into the nice guy that builds a good product by stuffing a box with great parts and selling direct which does win over a lot of guys.

Sorry to disagee but the leaders in the field of loudspeaker design all work for companies that can afford them.

Guys like Floyd Toole, Lawrence Dickie, are pushing that bar, Jack Oclee brown is another. Ever heard of Harmon, Vivid and Kef guess all of these guys produce inferior products to Salk right?

Sorry larry for having an opinion if i want to buy a real sports car i would go to a Porsche dealer not the kid selling a souped up Subaru down the street for a lot less.

Good luck to you.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor