speaker impeadance question


Hi everyone, 

Out of curiosity I was playing around with the 4 and 8 ohm taps on my Mcintosh MC601 mono blocks last night. I currently use Sonus Faber Olympica iii speakers which have a nominal impedance of 4 ohms. I have run them on 4 ohm from day one (non bi-wired), but I was quite surprised to hear that there is a very distinct difference in SQ (positive) moving from the 4 ohm taps to the 8 ohm. So after doing a little digging I was able to find the impedance plot for the speaker and according to the plot I can see why they are rated at 4 ohm but what I don't understand is why they sound so much better at 8 ohm. What I am concerned about is the huge spike at 3khz ..see link below:

https://www.soundstagenetwork.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1285:nrc-meas...

So I thought I would throw this out on the forum to see what you guys think in regards to using the 8 ohm taps based on this plot. 

Thanks in advance

-Keith
barnettk
Hi Bruce (Bifwynne),

McIntosh uses autoformers providing multiple output taps on many of their solid state amplifiers, and as far as I am aware they are unique in that respect. The rationale is presumably to make life easier on the output stage when low impedances are driven, by reducing the amount of current the output stage and the power supply must provide, and reducing the heat they will generate. One benefit of that presumably being a reduction in distortion. Their literature also talks about the autoformers providing benefits relating to speaker protection, including protection against DC being applied to the speakers in the event of a malfunction in the amp. My understanding is that an autoformer (as opposed to a transformer) can’t block DC, but perhaps the near zero impedance it would present to the output stage at zero Hz (i.e., at the "frequency" of DC) would trigger some other protection mechanism in the amp if that were to occur, and cause the amp to shut down.

A consequence of the autoformer approach is that those amps will provide the same rated maximum power capability when a 4 ohm load is connected to the 4 ohm tap, and when a 2 ohm load is connected to the 2 ohm tap, as when an 8 ohm load is connected to the 8 ohm tap. As is typical of many tube amps, and in contrast to just about all other solid state amps which of course will increase their power capability significantly as load impedances decrease, until some limit is reached.

And while this amp (each monoblock) weighs 93 pounds, I’d imagine that a solid state amp not using an autoformer, and that is capable of providing 600 watts into 8 ohms and far more into lower impedances, and that is comparably designed in other ways including robustness, would weigh a lot more due to the higher currents and additional heat sinking that would be required.

Just curious about the use of autoformers in this application and why the OP perceives that there is a sonic difference between the 4 ohm and 8 ohm taps.

The best answer I can provide is probably what I said in the last paragraph of my first post above, beginning with "So I would expect..."

I think Ralph may have posted several years ago that a DF of over 8 or maybe 10 isn’t all that important.

More specifically, what Ralph has said in some past threads is that "there is no speaker made that requires more than 20:1 for a damping factor."

In the OP’s case, I am surprised that his DF isn’t higher since his amp is solid state.

Just a guess, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the resistance of the autoformer winding is the main reason the DF is less than in most other solid state amps.

Best,
-- Al


@almarg  

Al,

just curious. What would be the benefit of using an amp that delivers constant voltage vs constant wattage? Is one type typically better than the other in regards to SQ? Or does it really all boil down to component matching?  

-Keith 
You don't exactly get constant wattage, or constant voltage.

What happens is that with high impedance amps and low impedance speakers is you can loose output power (i.e. dynamic range).

By having a 4 Ohm tap, your 75W tubes still put out 75W.  Otherwise, they might only put out 60 @ 4Ohms using the 8 Ohm tap.

This example is exceedingly soft. :) I suggest you find some Stereophile reviews to examine this more specifically.
Hi Keith,

First, it’s probably worth defining these terms for the benefit of others who may read this thread.

An amplifier which provides "constant voltage," aka one that acts as a "voltage source," is one that for a given input voltage provides an output voltage that does not vary significantly as a function of speaker impedance, assuming the amp is operated within its capabilities. Hence for a given input voltage it will deliver significantly more power at frequencies for which speaker impedance is low than at frequencies for which speaker impedance is high. (Power delivered into a resistive load equals voltage squared divided by resistance).  Most solid state amplifiers fall into this category.

An amplifier having "constant power" aka "constant wattage" characteristics will, for a given input voltage, tend to deliver less output voltage at frequencies for which speaker impedance is low, and more output voltage at frequencies for which speaker impedance is high. That will result in loosely approximating delivery of constant power into those varying impedances. Most tube amps fall into that category, to a loose approximation. How loose that approximation is will depend on both the output impedance of the particular amplifier (which varies widely among different tube amps), and on how the impedance of the particular speaker varies over the frequency range.

Which characteristic is better depends mainly on the particular speaker. The majority of speakers these days are designed with the expectation that they will be driven with voltage source amplifiers. But of course many are designed to work well with tube amps of various kinds. And some are suitable for use with either type. (The Daedalus speakers I use are an example of a speaker that is equally happy with either type, and that versatility is made possible by the fact that Daedalus speakers have a very flat impedance curve, i.e., their impedance does not vary very much over the frequency range).

If you haven’t seen it, Ralph (Atmasphere) has a good paper on this subject at his website:

http://www.atma-sphere.com/Resources/Paradigms_in_Amplifier_Design.php

Best regards,
-- Al

Thanks Al and Erik.  Good stuff. Thanks. For the info. Very interesting conversation.