What do you consider "loud" for your system?

Given the dynamics of most of our systems, in the average in room, at the listing position, loudness is very hard to measure. I believe if listening at an average loudness of 80dB, most of us are likely experiencing peak levels above 100dB on many recordings. These peaks are often so short in duration that many of our home measuring devices don't respond quick enough to capture. 

Just my thoughts. Feedback would be appreciated. 

mesch -- I don't think the dynamics of most modern digital recordings -- particularly pop & rock -- support a 20 dB peak in the recording format. And, it its not available on the recording, it can't be heard in your system.

I've used Adobe Audition for many years and looked at thousands of recordings and I can tell you that that 90+ dB dynamic range on a CD is largely unused. Most modern recordings (especially victims of the "loudness wars") are heavily compressed and allow only a few dB for peaks, and sometimes not even that.

Classical and some jazz does make better use of the available dynamic range. Back in the 90s it was common to see the average volume on a classical CD much lower with lots left for headroom. I've noticed the modern classical recordings don't do that as much as they used to.

I agree with everything in Mlsstl’s post just above, except that I would add an important clarification to the following statement:

I can tell you that that 90+ dB dynamic range on a CD is largely unused.

It’s important to distinguish between the dynamic range of the medium and the dynamic range of the music. The dynamic range of the music refers, of course, to the difference in volume between the loudest notes and the softest notes. However the dynamic range of the medium needs to be vastly greater than that, to capture the detail in each of the notes. And therefore much of the 90+ db dynamic range of the CD medium is still necessary even if the music has been compressed to a dynamic range of less than say 10 db.

I also agree, btw, with Mesch’s statement that many home measuring devices are unlikely to be fast enough to fully capture the amplitude of very brief dynamic peaks. Although my Radio Shack **digital** SPL meter, model 33-2055, set for fast response and for "C" weighting, seems to do a pretty good job. I say that based on comparisons between measurements I’ve made with it of some classical recordings having particularly wide dynamic range, and waveform observations I’ve made of those same recordings on a computer, using a professional audio editing program.

BTW, as a point of interest there are at least two classical recordings in my collection that I’ve found to have a dynamic range that by means of those waveform observations I’ve determined to have a dynamic range of approximately 55 db, which is simply amazing! Those are the Telarc recording of Stravinsky’s "Firebird Suite," Robert Shaw conducting the Atlanta Symphony, and the Sheffield Lab recording of Prokofiev’s "Romeo and Juliet," Erich Leinsdorf conducting the LA Philharmonic. Both were apparently recorded in 1978.

Correspondingly, when I listen to those recordings at an average level just in the mid-70s at my listening position, with the softest notes in the vicinity of 50 db, brief dynamic peaks reach approximately 105 db at my listening position!

Best regards,
-- Al

Loud for me is 85db. Normal listening levels for me are around 60db. Not exactly a head banger anymore!  That ship has sailed.

Just to clarify, dynamic range can be looked at in more than one way.

My comments above were directed toward the original post -- the perception of how loud the music seems when listening -- richmos said he is listening at 90 dB with 96 dB peaks, using a classic rock album.

I looked at the song "Money." The Audition statistics showed a 59 dB dynamic range, with periodic peaks 10 dB above the average level. That's pretty good for a rock record (but it is an "old school" recording.) So, you can see that there is nowhere close to 20 dB in peaks above the average listening level.

The other thing good dynamic range can do is let you hear instruments and sounds that are much softer and in the background while the overall volume level is loud. A poor dynamic range will leave these softer sounds buried in the background noise.