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At what price point do I run into diminishing returns on an MC Cartridge?

I need to replace my MC cartridge.  I've had limited experience with them but I have certainly noticed a dramatic difference in performance.  My first 3 were priced at $500 Sumiko, $900 Ortofon and $5000 Linn Kandid.  The difference between my first cartridge and second - nearly double in price, was a very noticeable improvement.  Then I took the plunge and spent $5000 (after tax) for my Linn Kandid cartridge.  The difference and improvement in the quality of sound was startling.  The soundstage was like nothing I'd ever heard before.  Coupled with my newly acquired McIntosh MP 1100 phono pre-amp and I was hearing things in LP's that quite frankly I had never heard before.  Amazing!  So here's the question: At what price point do I run into seriously diminished returns on a cartridge investment?  I rather doubt I'm going to have "double" the quality of sound that I received with my Linn Kandid cartridge if e.g. I went up to a $10K cartridge. So, my question to you audiophiles with loads of experience, what is your opinion on what price point (neighborhood) would take me to a place where every dollar spent thereafter would yield only micro returns.  Said another way, what is the best price point to take anyone to the the same neighborhood as a person with "money to burn" on cartridges?  BTW, I realize there are probably some pearls that don't cost nearly as much - and that money doesn't always buy you love.  If you KNOW of those do tell.         
normantaylor
grgaudio's avatar
grgaudio
38 posts
 
to

Daveyf,

The styluses have different configuration. Conical stylus has one face. The sophisticated Shibata or Micro Ridge like have up to 32 faces. To mount and align such on a cantilever takes laser beam technology to get the angles right. When using, any mis- guidance or mis-aligning damages the original shape quite fast and easy.  All styluses diamonds are lab created and polished these days. Also, some cheap styluses were made of ruby/sapphire like composite or different corundum composites. Sometimes they were good for just 100-200 hours.

You are more than welcome to believe in long life of damphers because you have experience and hear it right. We test these with proper devises, have results and I stand behind my words.
daveyf's avatar
daveyf
2,871 posts
 
@grgaudio Do tell how you test dampers --er.. damphers?
Styluses do indeed have different shapes..configurations, and the cut can have a connection to the length of its life, but that is nothing to do with the quality of the diamond, simply to the wear pattern of the shape.
BTW, there is no conclusive evidence that I have ever seen that actually truly shows wear patterns on the surface of the diamond after x number of hours. Not saying that the stylus does not wear out, but there is no predictable pattern of wear regardless of the shape.
grgaudio's avatar
grgaudio
38 posts
 

to

Daveyf,

 We test damphers in laboratory here in USA, In Europe and home. There are many instruments to do testing. Some are simple and we can do this at home. Some are very sophisticated- we do lab tests.

All lab created diamonds are different quality. Different polishing quality too. The worst are G from Europe, The best are A from Japan. There are some in between.

Most of users never understand how stylus reads the grove and stereo grove in particular. In few words when stylus wears it becomes more dull and bigger surface/diameter. It does not go as deep in a groove as it used to and not scanning the vertical groves well. So the more stylus wears- the more mono you hear. Some report this as dullness, some hear distortion, some say the cartridge don't sound fresh and musical anymore.
daveyf's avatar
daveyf
2,871 posts
 
@grgaudio  Interesting hypothesis you have there. Damphers ( not dampers??) tested in your lab...:o)
terry9
2,333 posts
 
As to stylus wear, 1000 hours may be an average, but it’s by no means necessary. That’s all the more reason to have a linear tracker.

And an ultra-sonic record cleaner. In the old days I used a VPI 16.5 faithfully. When I read that record groove crud was equal parts fluff, grease, and diamond dust, I realized that it was an ideal grinding compound, ready and able to grind the faces off any stylus. So I went ultra-sonic.

When I went US, a huge amount of crud came out of the grooves - it was quite visible when it settled on the bottom of the tank. Microscopic inspection shows that my post-US stylus is slightly and symmetrically worn after 940 hours. I hope to get a few thousand more. That means, at the cost of my retip, the US cleaner pays for itself and then some. Actually, and then, quite a lot.
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