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Seriously considering tube preamp…opinions?

Tube virgin, here. I am building a system and I'm trying to contain the preamp/amp cost to $3k or so. (I could go up a little.) 

I'm inclined not to dive into tubes all the way through, but get a solid state on the output end. (Open to suggestions; inclined toward PS Audio, Parasound.) I'm reading around about tube preamps and have talked with my local dealer, who sells Black Ice/Jolida and Prima Luna (PL). He used to carry Rogue but said they kept coming back for repairs. That's why he carries PL.

I'm asking these questions after having established (via reviews, comments) that Schiit gear is quite the value. Lately, I've been reading about Decware and other small tube makers. I'm very curious about buying direct, if possible, and a company that stands behind their products is crucial.

So, your opinions about tube integrated or *especially* tube preamps —

1. Who do you like? Consider I want to do pre/amp for a total of $3k if possible.

2. Do you think PL is worth all that money just for a preamp? I get the feeling they're high quality but a bit over-hyped. (No disrespect to the highly passionate Kevin Deal, but he's all over my search results.) And what would you think about $2k/$1k preamp-to-amp spending ratio?

3. Any sense of what happened to Jolida since the name change to "Black Ice"? I see there's a sordid story there but did the re-branding clear up the mess? Any experiences with the Black Ice company?

4. I know there are many Schiit fans out there; so my question would be -- did anyone consider Schiit for tube preamp and go another way? Or move beyond Schiit for any particular reason? It's hard not to just capitulate and do a Freya+ or Saga+ but why wouldn't one just go with Schiit?




128x128hilde45
jjss49's avatar
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jjss49
6,612 posts
 
To me tube gear gives a great sense of tactility space and humanity to the sound. More natural more relaxed more spacious. But usually at the expense of some background noise, ultimate bass control and very high volumes. Obviously uber expensive tube systems minimize the negatives, while accentuating the positives.

Depending on the kind of music one listens to, the tradeoff may or may not be worth it.

But for vocal, classical, jazz music, music that is more old school, i.e. created with less electronica/mixing overlays and played at more natural (unamplified) instrument volumes, the tradeoffs are much worth it to go for tubes.
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hilde45 OP
5,030 posts
 
It's hard to say what sound I'm after, but I've had solid state all my life, and couple experiences with tubes changed my attitude. So, I'm taking a plunge in that direction, and knowing about the sensitivity factor helps widen the playing field for varieties of amps.
oldhvymec
5,101 posts
 
One thing I've noticed in this thread, "The system" revolves around the Preamp. Others seem to center on power amps. Then there are people who build from the speaker, BACK.

Then those that have learned that ALL the speakers, amps, preamps, and cabling are just 30-40% of the sound. The room, the Power supply, the placement, matching components, vibration control, Source, EVERYTHING else, but gear should be considered. 

I'm sure you've got a handle on good VAC, cabling and like.  I'm not here to say one brand is better than the other, but I will say, I like tone control in my preamps, I like Lpads in my speakers. Those TWO thing are really controversial. HE speakers with lpad can be tuned and toned down. Same with Preamps, small differences in SOURCE, sometimes a tonal change, (not TOTAL).. make for a much easier fix, than gear change or just can't listen to it.

One of my systems still uses 78 mono stuff from time to time, its old I mean REAL old...Those preamps are point to point. I wouldn't use that system with several sources hooked up... Crosstalk.. You won't like it, if you haven't dealt with it before.

If you're looking for pieces of art, there are some truly fantastic pieces out there. If your looking at tube sound with a practical application, in mind. PtoP can be tough and expensive to get right.  IMHO though ptop is the bomb, Vinyl a great valve set up... you'll be playing hooky from work for sure..

I like ALL the different stuff, A great Valve preamp and a pair of great SS amps, just crazy good..No names but Class Ds are a great combo for me.

Enjoy, 51 years a ValveHead... Just wonderful..

Respectfully
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atmasphere
11,909 posts
 
Its a simple fact that if the front end of the system doesn't get it right, the best amps and speakers downstream won't win you any of the lost signal.


For this reason I do feel that a good tube preamp is paramount. But tubes bring something to the amplifier department as well. Tube amplifiers generally speaking tend to have greater soundstage width and depth than solid state, and tend to have more detail without brightness (this on account of how both technologies make distortion).
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