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My Demo results: I feel like I'm at a frustrating block in my speaker journey

Hi all,

New poster and longtime lurker. 

As the title says, I feel like I'm at a frustrating endpoint in my audio quest, and hoping to draw from your guys' experience for some direction.

I bought my first speaker system a couple years ago because at my old house my tv speakers were not cutting it. 

First I bought an old budget pair of Klipsche bookshelves (P15s?  I dont really remember)  They were really shrill, and I sold them fairly quickly. 

After reading a bunch of the mainstream audio review sites (I now understand these platforms are often pay to play) I purchased the ELAC Unifi UF5 Towers.  These had beautiful, lush musical bass but sounded about engaging as energetic as a sponge.  They also had kind of a dark muffled sound at times- like there is a wet blanket over them.   Paradoxically, they also sound inorganic and kind of metallic. 

In the past few months I decided to start demoing speakers to see what I like.  Ive found some speakers that do certain things right, but not everything right.  Every one of the high-end, expensive speakers I have tried have had certain large flaws. I've been kind of shocked at this whole experience, because to my ears my $60 set of logitec computer speakers handily beats a number of speakers 50x more expensive. Like, they dont have great detail retrieval or clarity but at least they dont color the sound a ton, and they present very engagingly.

Im still lookijng for my goldilocks speaker.

  • Various Kefs- very similar to the ELACs but worse imo- very metallic and unengaging
  • Various B&W- Metallic, boring, no dynamics
  • Warfedale Evo 4.4- nice highs!  Absolutely sloppy bass (for my room at least) and terribly muddy mids
  • Tannoy Revolution 6XTE- Similar to above.  Very, very dark speakers.
  • Martin Logan 35XTI bookshelves-  Eureka!  These are much more organic and clear.  Guitars actually sound like guitars instead of a bad digital rendering of them.  Theres energy in what I listen to.  This is what I was missing in the others... things sound like theyre supposed to!   Only issue is they arent as full-bodied as towers.  They just cant play very loud and I wish they had more bass to be better full range speakers.    Somewhat more minor issue is that they sound slightly grainy.  Though thats not a total dealbreaker. 
  • Martin Logan 60XTI Towers- I had high hopes for these.... but where did the magic for the 35s go ML?  These are very "meh".  The highs and satisfying acoustic resonances are gone.
  • Focal Aria 906 bookshelves- holy clarity batman!  But it sounds almost too clinical to the point that theyre not engaging.
  • Focal Aria 948 Towers-  Holy clarity and body batman!  These sound almost perfect- but they dont quite come alive until higher volumes (and I have a small space), and there's still something missing... a certain *zing* in the acoustic guitar resonances. 
  • Def Tech 9060- Hard to describe.  Sometimes they sounded good, sometimes they sounded imprecise and like the drivers were way too small.  Bass gets bloaty in my room.  Theyre also ugly as hell. 
  • Ascend Sierra Tower with RAAL-  After all the others, I had only tthe ML 35XTIs and the focal 948s remaining.  I was hoping, based on my extensive reading of forums, that the ascend towers could give the best of both worlds- the clarity/full body of the focals with the acoustic resonance/energy/zing of the MLs.  Unfortunately I was once again disappointed.  They seem unbalanced to my ears.  Like, they have very punchy bass but they color the sound to be sweet and there seems to be something missing in the middle of the sound.... some body that just isnt there.  The highs are very sweet and engaging, but almost a little artificially so.  Where the MLs sound like an actual acoustic guitar being played in front of me, the Sierras make it sound unnaturally sweet or high.  Theres unnaturally sweet zzzing out of string instruments that I dont think actually sound that way....  Im bummed because I really wanted to like these speakers. 


I think I've established a list of qualities Im looking for:
  • The etched sound of the MLs
  • Full body and clarity of the Focals
  • The forward, engaging nature of the ascends
  • Not overly smooth
  • Not metallic (I dont think I like aluminum tweeters)
  • wide horizontal dispersion (my room is wider than it is long)

Where do I go from here?  Im at a loss.  Id appreciate any recommendations you guys have. 

mjt8
rikkipuu's avatar
rikkipuu
278 posts
 
I second the Magnepan 3.7i. with 2 subwoofers  However they only sound as good as your power conditioning, gear and cables. 
Or consider an open baffle speaker.  For me I tire of the box sound of box speakers under  $12-15,000.
df00
6 posts
 
You probably like your Logitech because your ears are within 18" of them and you are not getting any room interaction.  

Forget speaker, amp, DAC and whatever else upgrades. Get an EQ! learn to use it, and play with your speaker placement and room treatments, if any.  

I have three systems and each has an EQ.  Yamaha 10-band, DN360 31 band, and a miniDSP 2x4hd.  In all three cases the system sounds better with the EQ than without.  

I guess the upgrades business are the reason EQs are frowned upon. 
calvinj
2,320 posts
 
Gato fm50
reaper60
5 posts
 
So I see this thread has been beaten to death and the waters muddied to an extreme but this hits home as I have had similar issues with a very strangely shaped and small room. I have two set ups that I suggest you give a listen to.

1: small monitors on desk / stands. I am using the Elac Navis monitors in my very small unusual shaped 5 sided room. Despite all of that it sounds incredible. To be fair I have used Dirac through an NAD C658 to help dial in the sound. If you go with a powered monitor like the Navis you can afford a nicer front end because you aren’t paying for amplification. I have currently removed the NAD and added a Topping DX7 Pro which is there because this is also a headphone set up for me and the synergy is wonderful. Sub isnt required but a small fast sub in the future like a REL would certainly be welcome.
 - as an aside I also have a rather rare studio monitor set up that I swap in when mood strikes. They are Gibson Les Paul 8’s. This is Gibsons first and only studio monitor and they are gorgeous. They have the sunburst finish of a Les Paul guitar and some very revealing highs. I use them primarily for acoustic music as it just gets the guitars right. Im am an amateur guitarist and a classically trained upright bassist so I have an ear for stringed instruments. However I find them a bit too forward for music that is more digital like todays popular styles. They have adjustments on bass and treble so you can tailor the sound, but it seems obvious these were built for the sweet sounds of rock and acoustic music more than the electronic types.

My second system that regular leaves me in awe was mentioned by another member here: Revels. I demoed their towers and bookshelves and settled on the M106 Bookshelves for my needs. Their sound is sweet but precise. The treble is lerfect even off axis, and they fill my room (19x12 open on 2 sides to other rooms) with beautiful music. I use them daily as my TV speakers as well. They are currently IN a bookcase. They come with foams for the ports and I have them installed. Bass response is effected in the lower registers this way but it works perfectly with a small subwoofer I have installed. Im driving these from an NAD M10 integrated which is small and attractive and works perfectly with everything else I have going on. (Streaming, etc,) it also has Dirac built in which helps to fix resonances and issues with their poor placement. Given I have 2 1/2 year old twins the bookshelves and having the speakers out of the way was just a requirement. The runner up in my demoes was the Kef R3’s but I found the form of the Revels more attractive.

both of these systems are around $3-4k in price. Speakers are both $2k a pair and the electronics on the elacs with my Topping Dx7 Pro is certainly much lower in cost (but not in features or performance!). For the moment I am now a happy cat and looking at exploring headphones more for while the kids are sleeping. Loving my Focal cans right now.
bhd72
11 posts
 
I'm a late poster here, so forgive me if I'm repeating others.  I've found that allowing speakers (and all components for that matter) to break in makes a huge difference.  The difference in speakers is largely in bass, but in some speakers tweeters also smooth out with use.  Tannoys in my former listening room (a very lively one) were too bright--the opposite of dark.  I'm not sold on a single brand, but I have found Tannoy Revolution XT8Fs are incredibly flexible--tight and deep bass with good highs that accurately reflect their source (for better or worse).  I have now moved and my room is far less reflective; my Tannoy XT8Fs have settled in while also coming alive.  As I audition new components, they never fail to reveal differences--including that of breaking in new components!  I would not say they are the most involving--that honor goes to Sonus Faber Cremona Ms, though likely many others too.  Best of luck in your search--it's worth it!
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