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High Output Preamp for First Watt SIT-3?

I'm new to the audiophile world and recently purchased a First Watt SIT-3 with Magnepan .7s.  I have a Mytek Brooklyn Bridge for streaming, though I prefer to play vinyl with my Mofi Ultradeck.  The Mytek serves as the phono stage (69dB gain for MM?), and I don't use a preamp;  the Brooklyn is connected directly to the First Watt. 

I understand that the SIT-3 is only 11.5 dB of gain, and that's extremely low compared to most amps.  I like most everything about the system except for the fact that I have the Mytek maxed out volume-wise many days.  Certain LPs are cut quieter, and I wish I had more power.  There are times streaming where the Maggies aren't getting to their sweet spot.  I realize the Maggies are a lower sensitivity speaker. 

What should I look for in a preamp to fully drive the SIT-3?  Eventually, I'd like to replace the phono stage instead of relying on the Brooklyn.  Is there a tube preamp featuring a phono stage with sufficient output to drive my amp in the $4k range?  Otherwise, I'm eyeing the Modwright PH 9.0 and a linestage preamp, realizing that this will probably be costlier.  I'm looking for a warm sound, not analytical but engaging. 

Any help is greatly appreciated.  I'm a working musician with a basic understanding of related electronics but little experience in this world. 

murphbass
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 

kinara,

murphbass began this  thread by explaining in many cases he's been very happy with the sound quality (SQ) of his S.I.T.3 and Maggie pairing. He did however certainly cite  that there are some observed shortcomings as well. He wondered if it could be a lack of power "I wish I had more power" in certain situations or is more gain needed?

He straightforwardly was soliciting  input/suggestions on this forum regarding his dilemma.  IMO his generated some very informed responses and interesting dialogue and commentary. Posters did not dispute his claim of very good SQ with his amp/speaker pairing. Opinions were expressed and shared in regard to what might be suitable solutions to his 'stated'  concerns. I believe that murphbass gained some additional insight and appreciates the many  good responses he received.

So I don't understand your characterization of "shooting from the hip" which seems dismissive of what were well intentioned and thoughtful replies to murphbass's clearly stated concerns. I don't doubt you hear very good sound with your S.I.T. 3 and Maggie 20.7 but would this be your ideal long term amplifier for these speakers? It so then I hope they continue to provide you many years of listening pleasure.

Charles.

kinara
6 posts
 
Charles, I apologize if that was the impression, there have certainly been some informed and cogent replies except that they were not addressed to the question at hand. I was just somewhat surprised by the fact that the subject heading - the search for a suitable high gain preamp for the SIT-3 quickly devolved from the first post into "you have the wrong speaker-amp combo". That was not what the poster was asking for or about, but since that appeared to way the thread was going, I threw in my two pennies worth on Maggies and their infamous power requirements. Frequently it's an issue of how the speaker behaves across it's impedance curve and the demands that makes on partnering amps. For example, driving Quad ESL 57's has never been about watts but finding amps that can cope with the ESL's wicked load impedance behaviour. After all, Peter Walker drove them with 15W amps. Similarly, I drive my Harbeth P3's with 10 watts (admittedly near field) from a Luxman SQ Integrated with great success. My SIT-3/20.7 run was simply an experiment, in normal existence , they are driven by 450W VAC amps, which is more appropriate. Someone once told me that "tube watts are not the same thing as SS watts and Class A watts are not the same thing as Class A/B watts". I think there's some truth to that. I am planning to match my SIT-3 up with Harbeth 30.2's but within a near field listening envelope and I am pretty confident it will work well, albeit not to head banging levels. I would still love to hear some thoughts from everyone on appropriate high gain preamps to pair with the SIT-3. The Modulus 3B has a ton of gain but customer service and reliability issues plague the Company. Happy to hear some input on that. Thank you.
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Hi kinara,
I understand your point regarding the straying away from the original thread inquiry about high gain preamplifiers. I just believe that people were trying to point out that this wasn’t simply an issue of additional ’gain'  to solve the problem expressed by the OP. In fact he (murphbass) later in this thread came to the realization that adding more gain to his system via a preamplifier wasn’t the course he wanted to follow.

BTW kinara I do happen to share your appreciation of high quality low power amplifiers. I’ve been a very happy owner of an 8 watt 300b SET amplifier for over 10 years. I do readily acknowledge that it (terrific as it is) is not the right choice for everyone and speaker selection requires thought and scrutiny.
Charles
rwpollock's avatar
rwpollock
89 posts
 
Murph, if you are still looking for a preamp I would suggest going back to Herb's review of the SIT-3 in Stereophile. He did indeed find a good match with the Maggies.

"The SIT-Maggie combo generated a distinctive, liquid, ribbon-tweeter clarity that also flattered sopranos in a way not bested by any other amp-speaker combination I've tried. Voices and instruments were no less there than they were with the Pass Labs XA25 or the Bel Canto Design e.One REF600M, and that's saying a lot—those amps make really SOLID sound with the Magnepan .7s. Wilder still, the SIT-3 generated more relaxed, natural detail and a bigger, better-mapped soundstage than I'd previously thought possible with these humble planars."

Given that success, look to Herb's preamp choices. He uses two -- the Rogue RP-7 and the PrimaLuna DiaLogue. He did not say which one was better in this case. You might send him an e-mail and ask.

- Robert
eugene81
270 posts
 
Chiming in late here, but would like to add that I have a SIT-3 that sounds wonderful with my Maggie 1.6.  Of course, I do not listen very loudly but at moderately high levels (guesstimating 90-95 dB) the SIT-3 sounds significantly better than my former 400 WPC Bel Canto Ref 500S.  Currently, I mainly use my Maggies with a 250 WPC McIntosh MC252 and don't appreciate any loudness or dynamic differences and in fact would ultimately prefer the First Watt.  

In OP's case I would audition the Pass Labs XA25 to replace the SIT-3.  I also had that amp and would switch back and forth between it and the SIT-3.  The XA25 sounds similar but plays louder at 20 dB gain.  It also opens up an easy trade-in option with Reno HiFi.
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