2. analog
  3. 158629-148767

AT-ART9 cartridge on Marantz TT-15s1 - I don't think I'm getting the performance I should

Some time ago, frustrated with what was likely cartridge alignment issues coupled with worn LPs, I upgraded my cart and sold my VPI Scout turntable and now have an AT-ART9 on a Marantz TT-15s1.  That turntable was recommended to me because of its relative simplicity in cartridge alignment.  I've been really enjoying the fullness and clarity of the AT-ART9 on some LPs.  By "some" I've found that I mean records without obvious wear and that are cut on the quiet side. 

What's bugging me is that I feel l am getting far from the best out of this cart.  I have read that it is REALLY finicky to dial in for best tracking results, and my cart doesn't appear to be tracking a lot of records well at all.   I started buying a lot of vintage sealed records to eliminate groove damage from being the issue.  But I've noticed that almost every album that's cut on the "hot" side plagues me with distortion that gets worse as the stylus gets nearer to the inner grooves.   For example, I've played a lot of '80s hard rock and metal, and I can almost count on any album from that era cut on the Atlantic label in these subgenres to give me distortion that's clearly due to mistracking. 

What may set me apart from others on this forum is that I don't have buddies with comparable systems in driving distance from me where I can bring my records to hear on their systems, so I really have absolutely no basis for comparison.  I have just read people say that they have never heard IGD with this cart, whereas I hear it on many 75% of my LPs.  I don't have any problems with known audiophile pressings though, like new stuff cut by Chris Bellman, Kevin Gray, on the Classic Records label, etc. 

I used to have my cart professionally set up, but after finding that my dealer totally bungled the setup on my VPI the last time, I decided to learn how to do it myself.   I got myself several Stevenson protractors and a 3x magnifier so that I could see what I was doing, and it absolutely looks to me like I've got my cart aligned as perfectly as one can get it using the null points on the protractor.  

I *do* however think anti-skate is causing me problems with my configuration.  I did have it set too high and that absolutely caused me more distortion in the inner grooves as well as a large number of records "sticking" (i.e. repeating instead of skipping forward).   But even after adjusting this heavily, I still find that in the rare case that I have a used record that skips, the tonearm "sticks".   That, to me, suggests too much antiskate, but I have set the antiskate to be almost as minimal as possible from the best that I can tell. 

Absent of a local dealer that I've yet to find who I can trust to identify and fix this issue (especially since the nut used for setting antiskate on the Marantz is so loose that it would easily change while driving my TT back home), I'm at a loss having done everything I can do to possibly fix the problem. 

Based on what I'm saying here and your experiences, am I most likely missing out on the supreme tracking abilities of this cart, or is there just a lot of really bad pressings and damaged used vinyl out there?   And if it's the former as I suspect, is there anything about the Marantz's tone arm that suggests it's not up to the task of supporting this cart?  




izgoblin
izgoblin OP
11 posts
 
Thanks for all of the responses!   I'm embarrassed to have to make one correction - it was the Baerwald alignment I did go with, not the Stevenson as I incorrectly said. 

I am going to definitely focus on setting azimuth which I previously did not, because quite simply, the manual that came with the Marantz gave no indication on how to adjust this.  That manual focuses more on the quick and easy alignment of the cart that it shipped with, which I found to track well but offered a completely unengaging sound on the best recordings.  As much as it hurts to have to pay another $300 for a fozgometer, I suppose it is a relatively small price to pay given what I've already invested into this system.

I found on another forum a link to the manual for the Clearaudio Satisfy Kardan tone arm which appears to be the same as or at least incredibly similar to the Clearaudio-produced tonearm that ships with the Marantz.  This provides an indicator on how to adjust the azimuth and even points out a simple error I made in setting antiskate.   So I will work on these and hopefully report success soon!
cleeds
6,275 posts
 
izgoblin
That manual focuses more on the quick and easy alignment of the cart that it shipped with, which I found to track well but offered a completely unengaging sound on the best recordings ...
If you found the sound "un-engaging" perhaps the cartridge was not tracking nearly as well as you thought.

Some users think if a cartridge doesn't skip or get stuck in locked grooves, that it "tracks well." But if you accept the common definition of good tracking - the ability to accurately trace a groove with minimal wear - you'll see it differently.

For example, look at the popular Shure SC35C cart, which uses a spherical stylus that tracks around 5 grams. I guarantee you that this cartridge will rarely fail to stay in the groove; skipping or getting stuck is extremely unlikely - that's part of why DJs liked them so much. But with a 5 gram VTF, it's going to put a lot of wear on your LPs. Its spherical stylus is physically incapable of tracing high frequencies - the fat stylus simply can't trace grooves that small - and even at low frequencies, it's likely to struggle with high amplitude grooves. So we can say that the Shure SC35C is not a "good tracker," unless your only criteria is that the stylus stays in the groove.

You really need a test record to verify a cartridge's tracking ability.
izgoblin OP
11 posts
 
I played a few more old but sealed LPs today and heard IGD on every one of them, so it's clear that something is very wrong with my setup.

I got the Fozgometer and the Analog Productions Ultimate Analogue Test LP and checked the reading only to find that my azimuth was way off.  Great!   I was getting a much higher reading from the right channel than the left - it wasn't close.  So this felt promising.  I made the adjustments - took me a few tries to get it closer - but I quickly noticed something is very wrong.  The only way I was able to achieve a reasonably close reading between the left and right channel was to tilt the cartridge ridiculously to the right.  I don't mean just a little, I mean a lot - so I couldn't possibly achieve the correct overhang and azimuth at the same time.  

It would seem logical to replace the RCA cables from the turntable to the fozgometer as a test, but those are not removable from the tonearm.  So I'm not sure if I have some other problem that's causing the signal to lean heavily towards the right or what's going on here.  

I welcome any thoughts, but I am also going to see if I can get a local dealer to check it out.  Unfortunately the one I used to go to steered me wrong in a previous setup by rushing through it, so I have no faith they will get it right.  I really wanted to be able to do this myself, but I don't know what else I can do from here.

stringreen's avatar
stringreen
6,531 posts
 
Very rarely will a dealer take the time and effort needed to check, recheck, move it a little this way, that, etc. Have you visually checked that the stylus is centered and that it looks correct?? where do you live? The cartridge is a good one if not damaged.  Too little/too much a/s is not the problem
izgoblin OP
11 posts
 
Drat, having an "expert" take a look at it feels like my only hope.   I live in Thorndale, Pennsylvania not too far from Philadelphia.  I'd gladly drive a few hours to find the right person, but Google isn't helping me here unfortunately, and I imagine COVID is hurting my chances of finding someone even more.

Yes, by eyeballing it, it certainly doesn't look like the cantilever is bent or anything weird like that.  And as for the cartridge (or stylus/cantilever) being damaged, anything is possible, but I couldn't for the life of me figure out how that could be.   I probably only have 100 hours on the cart at most?  It was purchased new in December 2019.

Unfortunately I can't be 100% sure of this because I didn't take many notes nor do I make needledrops that I can refer to, but I believe this cartridge performed much better when I first set it up.   It struck me that *maybe* around the break-in period, I started noticing more problems.  It definitely wasn't a situation where I woke up one day and everything was off.  But when I first got the cart, I played a few records and made detailed notes which included that all of them had no perceived tracking issues whatsoever.  So then I stopped making notes.  :-)  The sound in general was an improvement over the AT33PTG/II cart that I previously had on my VPI Scout.  But after a while, I found I'd go back to records I noted were totally NM previously and now I'd be hearing distortion that sounded like groove wear.   I re-aligned, changed VTA, antiskate and tracking force and never solved the problem.  On anything that was cut even remotely hot, I'd hear IGD.   This new development with the Fozgometer seems like it should be exposing the problem, but with my luck, I can't help but wonder if it's not a different problem.
More to discover