High Performance Audio - The End?

@douglas_schroeder

“If you’re running a $5-10K rig, then do not expect such music to sound great.”

When reading it i was speechless...

Ignorance? Snobbery? Delusion of new riches? Certainly not informed audio management installation.... What i call the triple embedding....

My system value is 500 dollars, i dont pretend that it will beat costly system, i pretend they will eat their spoon with surprize to make so much with so little on their point of view for sure...

I know better now, and i had learn that audio is the art of engineering when you create a design, but the art of embedding when you have bought it....

Only non reflexive mind or conditioned consumers thinks that audio products are ready to go to their best out of the box....

And now, let’s take a look at my comment in context, shall we?
Here it is:

ALL genres of music sound superior on a superb system. As a reviewer I use many genres of music, some which I do not care to hear regularly. These are valuable to assess the outer limits of performance. Without fail, the better the audio system, the better all genres of music sound on it.

The fact of the matter is that the bulk of audiophiles’ systems are not that good. Contemporary music sounds bad on these systems because they simply cannot handle it, while superior systems can. It’s foolish to blame the genre of music when the system is poor. If you’re running a $5-10K rig, then do not expect such music to sound great. Conversely, anyone can delude themselves into thinking their system is all that when it sounds good playing simpler, less challenging music. The fact is that if the modern music sounds poor on your system, then it’s not that great of a system, and/or you didn’t set it up well.

Fact: in the spectrum of performance $5-10K systems are not great. Does that mean a person cannot enjoy the experience of listening to their system in that price range? Not at all, and that should have been evident by my discussion of such systems not handling demanding music. Instead, those with lower end rigs use that out of context to assault me as though disdaining less expensive rigs.

Whether you like it or not, a cheaper system is not all that. It cannot, will not, will never be as good as a much higher end rig. Take offense at that if you wish- it’s your issue. I wanted better, so I put a lot of money and effort (continuing) into it. If you don’t want to put the money and effort into it, great, but let’s not play a game of saying the cheap stereo is as good as the higher end one, or that you’re really getting somewhere by "embedding" it.

Have I ever mocked someone’s low cost rig? Never. I do debate people who insist that lower end rigs give essentially the same experience as upper end rigs. They do not. Only if you want to defend your budget, and say, "The both play music," can you defend that kind of conclusion. Once you discuss the quality of the experience - and as I was pointing out, the ability of a system to play exceptionally difficult recordings - then there is little comparison between a $5K rig and a $50K rig, at least if the person setting it up knows what they are doing. A rig that is $5-10K will almost universally have serious shortcomings in sound quality, as assessed from the entire spectrum of performance. Does this mean someone can't thoroughly enjoy it? No, but the topic here was problematic performance, and I assert that it's not so much the genre of music, but the inability of lower end systems to play it well. No amount of disdain directed toward me for that conclusion will change my opinion. It's not a matter of respect, but of performance, which is not a respecter of persons. 

Fact: The performance spectrum is far greater than most budget audiophiles are willing to accept. Moving to a system that is MSRP multiples higher will usually assure that you will be in an entirely different class of listening experience, not the least because of the difference In speakers used.

I was a budget audiophile for many years, attempting to convince myself that these things were not so. I hold zero disdain of budget audio. I hold disdain for those who attempt to mock, ridicule, or marginalize higher end audio as though it is a rip-off or "diminishing returns".

The fact of the matter is that the bulk of audiophiles’ systems are not that good. Contemporary music sounds bad on these systems because they simply cannot handle it, while superior systems can. It’s foolish to blame the genre of music when the system is poor. If you’re running a $5-10K rig, then do not expect such music to sound great.

First i apologize for being a little rude with you...

Reading your posts i think that you are in a perfect good faith about your sayings and experience...

Second, we misunderstood each other.... I never say that anyone can reach the same level of quality with a system like mine and for example mike lavigne system...

But i said and by my own experience and 2 years listening experiments, that a modest system rightfully embedded outpace itself completely, and can reach another level totally , near high-end, under it but not light years behind sorry, if rightfully embedded...

Words are very important because ,not being clear put people at the end of an illusory and costly process of upgrading before embedding their system, never mind the price....

AT ANY PRICE, even 100,000 dollars system will outpace themselves rightfully embedded, then a modest system cannot reach their level even rifghtfully embedded...But will not be so much far from it than most people think....That is my point....

Is it clear?

But when we listen music, with all S.Q. on all counts very good, even if we are not on the same level that top high -end, we can enjoy ANY files or cd rightfully played....

Name a cd a modest system would not be able to render in an acceptable way?

I want to try it....Please i will wait for your suggestion of a cd that is difficult to listen to on a modest system....Thanks in advance and gives me in a few words why it is difficult to listen to it on a modest system....





Remember that what i call embeddings is not a bunch of costly tweaks please....It is a method of listening experiments that make anybody able to identify the lacks in his system and remedy them by cleaning, and controlling mechanical, and electrical grid, and mainly the very important acoustical setting of a small room...

The impact is so powerful than any upgrade even of speakers upgrade, in most cases, will be less impactful, except if the first speakers are already totally mediocre for sure to begins with...Choice of good components is mandatory, even if not costly one....


Thank you for accepting my apology...

I am sometimes too passionate.... :)

Thanks and my best regards....

@douglas_schroeder 

No one is attacking you. Matter of fact, I had a lot of respect for you. That’s why I said that I didn’t expect that from you. You should have known better. What makes your comments incorrect is the generalization. Not all 40k systems sound better than all 5k ones. Decades ago, I had a 5k system that sounded great and I decided to upgrade it. I spent thousands of dollars and ended up with a much worse system. It took me a while to recapture the magic and finally surpassed it. So I learned my lesson. 
What you should have said is, everything else being equal, more money should give you better sound. We all know that. Unless you reach a limit, you can always get better hardware. Whether it’s Mahgister getting more stones or me doubling my interconnects, we all can use more dough, but knowledge and experience count for something. The best amp is not necessarily the costliest. And then you add the variables that are out of our control and things can get complicated. That’s what makes this hobby fascinating. It’s not a sport for rich guys only.