Teach me about cartridge 'retipping'


Thought I would throw this out there for comment by long time vinyl aficionados...

We all have cartridges we love, some are pricey treasures... but they wear out eventually even with much care and diligence in use.

There are still some good folks with excellent reputations doing retip services of various makes - Peter at SS, Andy Kim in WA, Steve Leung in NJ etc etc... not to mention some of the manufacturers of course, who still do them. It would seem to me these old craftsmen may or may not be passing along these valuable skills to younger apprentices.

I have bought a couple Grace F9 retips from Peter Ledermann - they work wonderfully. No longer having a fresh factory F9L I will never know whether they sound different.  But they sound great.

Curious to hear comments about how these retips are done, and whether they can reliably reproduce the original sound signature of the cartridge. I wonder, for instance, about how the cantilever is removed and reinstalled, relative to the suspension of the original cartridge, etc etc.  Is the suspension replaced?  What is a suspension comprised of, for example, in a typical higher end MC cart like a Dynavector a Lyra a VDH...

Of course, as time passes, the original cartridges age and I can imagine suspensions in them eventually get compromised as well...
jjss49
Memory being what it is, it's difficult to say whether it's identical to the original. No matter - it sounds fantastic and is easily worth the few hundred it cost me to have it refurbished.

...and that's the point, ain't it?  

excuse the unintended pun... and all the egomania and snobbery aside

@needlestein mentions something really important about building great carts. Grading. Parts have tolerances. If you are building something great , and more than one, a system of grading parts must be implemented.  It is my opinion that ALL the great audio gear is heavily influenced by excellent building practice and excellent builders. It takes more than fancy parts to be at the top levels...
Oh and thanks to all the good and dedicated retippers out there!
My experience is limited. I had an old Monster Cable Sigma Genesis 2000 LOMC that was my favorite cartridge of all time. 
This is another great reason.  Some cartridge are just special to some people and a new one won’t do it.  Had someone recently send me one of these with a missing diamond.  They sent me a message about how they heard bad things about retippers, how it won’t sound the same, how the quality is poor, how it’s hit and miss, but he just loved the Sigma Genesis 2000 and he didn’t have any other alternative.  So, reluctantly, but hopefully, he sent it to me.  I put a new nude elliptical onto the end of the original boron cantilever that was only a little bit broken at the very tip—retaining 98% of its original length.  As soon as he got it, he sent me a glowing email about how happy he was to have the Genesis 2000 playing again and he said it sounded the exact same as before.  His skepticism all those years, he felt, was unfounded and he’d only wished he’d retipped it sooner.  I have a million stories like that.
I’m glad @needlestein jumped aboard here, with some fresh views on a subject that has been beaten to death here with the same old arguments.
Question for @chakster - I know you favor vintage cartridges, I have a friend who is also a big believer in them and says he is able to find old stock cartridges with little to no wear. Leaving aside the difficulty of determining this without a microscope and the knowledge of what the stylus shape should be in the first place, how does one avoid the hardening of the suspension parts over time?

I’ve used various retippers over the years from Peter, to A.J. Van den Hul to Steve Leung, for various cartridges, involving different kinds of work- in one instance, Peter replaced the stylus on a high end moving coil cartridge that was worn but retained the original cantilever.
More frequently, I’ll simply upgrade a cartridge rather than retip it. I did have Koetsu retip a Jade Platinum and when the other Koetsu I have reaches the end of its useful life, I’ll probably have that rebuilt by Koetsu- the cost is high, but is less costly than buying a new Koetsu (it would seem that the more expensive the Koetsu, the smaller the relative cost of rebuild is, no?)
Bill Hart
PS @Teo_Audio-- can you tell us more about this low cost cartridge you are introducing? I checked your website and did not see any mention of it.
Thanks.


Question for @chakster - I know you favor vintage cartridges, I have a friend who is also a big believer in them and says he is able to find old stock cartridges with little to no wear. Leaving aside the difficulty of determining this without a microscope and the knowledge of what the stylus shape should be in the first place, how does one avoid the hardening of the suspension parts over time?

You cartridge can be inspected by PRO if you wish to (for about $30), but i trust my ears, if a cartridge sound great I don’t need an inspection under microscope, I have a several macro lens for iPhone, my ears, some nice test records and music (and a bunch of amazing cartridges to compare one sample to another in a proper sound system or using headphones).

My passion is MM or MI cartridges, not vintage LOMC (even if I have some). Out of about 60 cartridges only 2 used samples were bad - this is my own experience (one of them is Technics EPS 100 and 205 series, another one is Glanz 71). The rest of the cartridges is a pure joy!

Nothing wrong with rubber damper if you know the right manufacturers. You must look for specific models of cartridges or certain brands. It’s about experience and knowledge.

You can make a stop list of cartridges / brands too. Technics is one of them! Suspension is softened, not hardened. Those cartridges must be avoided. At the same time most of the vintage MM are high compliance, if you believe that rubber damper can be stiffer in time then put your cartridge on Hi-Fi News TEST LP and measure resonance (and compliance). Even if (in theory) an old 40cu cartridge is 30cu now, this is still high compliance and nothing wrong with that! If you think a low compliance cartridge suspension is too stiff over the years then i want to remind you about FR-7fz which is a very low compliance LOMC with sealed suspension that last forever! One of the best low compliance LOMC in my opinion.

If you think a high compliance MM cartridge became a low compliance (which is impossible) then throw away that junk stylus, buy original replacement stylus in perfect condition and keep on using this cart. Maybe you lose $300 on that OG stylus, but a third party re-tip will cost about the same. 

I must admit that my journey into the world of vintage top of the line cartridges started after I tried some of the most expensive high-end LOMC cartridges with a price tag up to $5k.

On audiogon many people referring to vintage MM cartridges they bought and used 40 years ago, this opinion is irrelevant today, simply because of the faulty memories (it’s impossible to remember a sound character of a cartridge you tried when you was 30 years younger, also the system at that time is not what we have today).