WOW I didn't know that.
Speakers most critical component, , now what fq's are most critical in speakers
So now that we have established that speakers are the vocal chords of a system, thus making speakers the single most important component in any high fidelity system.
We need to open discussions of what fq's should we be ~most~ concerned about in deciding which speakers offer the highest fidelity within this hz range?
Bass 20hz-30hz, Can we just let this go for a moment, As there is really not much in classical within this range, Jazz you do have drum sets going on, its not all that much to be missed.
So really bass begins to be critical at 40hz.
High fq's, ,,,again is there really much happening in the highest registers in classical? Not really. jazz has snares and other percussion, but again, hardly much to make any dif if missed out in the say 12k+ hz registers.
I know Richard Gray did mention, although there might not seem to be much going on in the highest hz area, its the ~ambience~ which a high quality tweeter brings into the recorded sound. I agree.
Now we are left with the rest, the wide midrange area. Which represents 90%++ of our music.
lower mid-bass, starting at 50hz - 200hz
Low midrange 200hz-say 500hz
Mids 500hz-1khz
upper mids 1k-3k+++
These are rough figures
Point is, should we be so concerned about the 20-40hz's, when basically only less than 1% of the recordings possess this fq range. 1%, who really cares if it is not ~there~.
Now for the highest fq's, well again, should we really be so concerned how high a tweeter can voice?
The one design that strikes me as fulfilling this super critical midrange voicing with fidelity and a seamless wide band soundstage is the design callled high sensitivty wide band driver, otherwise known as ~The Full Range~
There is no so called ~mid`tweeter~ that can match the performance of these same fq's when compared to a high quality FR single source.
From the low mid bass all the way to highest upper mids, the FR just has a much larger voice coil and cone area for dispersion.
Mid tweeters are a failure, Including both Seas Flagships The Millenium and The Cresendo. When heard next to a quality FR .
With this single source wide band driver, no additional tweeter is needed.
Now in the low bass, say 30-80hz, it is recommended adding some sort of bass modual.
Which will bring in another dimension making the bass floor, more richer and dynamic, eliminates a sense of ~flatness~ about a single source's voicing.
Now I've not heard the single source drivers from the 2 highest labs. My guess is both labs also will benifit from added bass configure.
So now we need to look at what bass configures voice the cleanest, low distortion, sublime and subtle.
For this task, I recommend you look at Seas Excel either the older Magnesium Cone or the newst Magnesium cone called Graphene, which are like 50% more cost, Not sure if its worth it.
The ideal size will either be dual W18's, or a single W22, maybe even a W26.
This Magnesium cone material is so sublime in the 40-60hz's, that hardly any driver on the market will match it. With the copper phase plug. Not a neodymium magnet, but still packs a gorgeous tight rich 40-60hz bass , and voicing the low mids with pure clean fidelity. Pricey but worth it.
Capacitor for the Excel midwoofers should be Mundorf SilverGold Supreme of if you can afford it SESGO. 2X's the price of reg supreme. Superior vs their Aluminum model.
We need to open discussions of what fq's should we be ~most~ concerned about in deciding which speakers offer the highest fidelity within this hz range?
Bass 20hz-30hz, Can we just let this go for a moment, As there is really not much in classical within this range, Jazz you do have drum sets going on, its not all that much to be missed.
So really bass begins to be critical at 40hz.
High fq's, ,,,again is there really much happening in the highest registers in classical? Not really. jazz has snares and other percussion, but again, hardly much to make any dif if missed out in the say 12k+ hz registers.
I know Richard Gray did mention, although there might not seem to be much going on in the highest hz area, its the ~ambience~ which a high quality tweeter brings into the recorded sound. I agree.
Now we are left with the rest, the wide midrange area. Which represents 90%++ of our music.
lower mid-bass, starting at 50hz - 200hz
Low midrange 200hz-say 500hz
Mids 500hz-1khz
upper mids 1k-3k+++
These are rough figures
Point is, should we be so concerned about the 20-40hz's, when basically only less than 1% of the recordings possess this fq range. 1%, who really cares if it is not ~there~.
Now for the highest fq's, well again, should we really be so concerned how high a tweeter can voice?
The one design that strikes me as fulfilling this super critical midrange voicing with fidelity and a seamless wide band soundstage is the design callled high sensitivty wide band driver, otherwise known as ~The Full Range~
There is no so called ~mid`tweeter~ that can match the performance of these same fq's when compared to a high quality FR single source.
From the low mid bass all the way to highest upper mids, the FR just has a much larger voice coil and cone area for dispersion.
Mid tweeters are a failure, Including both Seas Flagships The Millenium and The Cresendo. When heard next to a quality FR .
With this single source wide band driver, no additional tweeter is needed.
Now in the low bass, say 30-80hz, it is recommended adding some sort of bass modual.
Which will bring in another dimension making the bass floor, more richer and dynamic, eliminates a sense of ~flatness~ about a single source's voicing.
Now I've not heard the single source drivers from the 2 highest labs. My guess is both labs also will benifit from added bass configure.
So now we need to look at what bass configures voice the cleanest, low distortion, sublime and subtle.
For this task, I recommend you look at Seas Excel either the older Magnesium Cone or the newst Magnesium cone called Graphene, which are like 50% more cost, Not sure if its worth it.
The ideal size will either be dual W18's, or a single W22, maybe even a W26.
This Magnesium cone material is so sublime in the 40-60hz's, that hardly any driver on the market will match it. With the copper phase plug. Not a neodymium magnet, but still packs a gorgeous tight rich 40-60hz bass , and voicing the low mids with pure clean fidelity. Pricey but worth it.
Capacitor for the Excel midwoofers should be Mundorf SilverGold Supreme of if you can afford it SESGO. 2X's the price of reg supreme. Superior vs their Aluminum model.
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- 15 posts total
While preping my Thor cabinets to accept the FA22RCZ, I noted the Thors had a lot of fluff white pcaking insulation, I ripped it all out, I mean it was stuffed all chambers it is a Transmisssion line, so has a wall running up center , opening below and then sound travels up the back line and out the top rear. Now these W18's really have PUNCH,,But actually too much. I will use attic insulation. Very easily you can peel off 75% of this 4 inch thick insulation, leaving about 1 inch. I will placea 12x12 piece behind each W18 and also the FA22RCZ. This way its dampened , but allows the bass to flow out transmission line top rear port. Might seem likea lot of bas, 3 woofers, but at my listening gain db, it should work OK. a single FR 8 inch will not deliver the low end that will make fora nice soundstage. Added woofers are needed for a single source driver. I also will cancel my idea about addinga W18NX003. I have more than enough bass with these W18E001 and I realize now why Seas chose the lighter of the 2 W18's, the 001, and not the heftier EX001. Dual 001's are more than enough bass. Dual EX001's would jave been bass heavy. I am not at all missing the 20-40hz's. The W18001 goes down to 40hz and its Rock Solid Bass. This elusive 20hz-40hz is not all that appealing to me. Itsactually going to bea nuance. I prefer low vol listening levels, and near field listening. The 20hz-40hz would perhaps might seem too agressive, and just get on my nerves after some listening. I am actually glad to cancel the W18NX003 project, The FA22RCZ arrives friday or saturday, I'll sart on cutting off the face plate of the Thors tomorrow and have things ready for the build. I will place the FA22RCZ sandwiched between the W18's, right where the Seas Millennium tweeter was ~~trying to carry mids and highs~~~ with success in light jazz, but not in classical orchestra. ONly a FR can voice orchestra/complex jazz with success in the mids/highs. . |
ONly a FR can voice orchestra/complex jazz with success in the mids/highs.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Not only Full Orchestra/complex jazz, But also no other speaker in the universe can voice female jazz vocals like a New High Tech Full Range, whether it be magnet or field coil Here is a field coli in female vocals HA! not even the $400k Wilsons can match this voicing. btw my house here in new orleans appraises near $400k. I'm guessing the Feastrex is like $40k https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0TrHCbq_Oyg |
Mozartfan. you are groveling in antiquity. First of all 20 to 40 Hz is an entire octave and all kinds of stuff happens down there that contributes greatly to the realism of the presentation like the thump you get when the bass player's thumb bangs the string. Many synthesizers frequently go that low. Lauri Anderson loved to do that. Systems that lack the ability to project bass under 40 Hz sound like the artificial music makers they are, wimpy. Arguably the finest tweeter operating on magnetic fields is the Magneplanar ribbon tweeter. The only driver better is an ESL. Some horns are up there. Dynamic drivers are uniformly terrible. They are a poor impedance match to air and they spray high end indiscriminately all over the place bouncing off everything creating a high frequency din that is indecipherable. You really have to move beyond dynamic drivers with the exception of subwoofers. Ribbons, Planar magnetics, horns and ESLs all done well are seriously superior. And forgetting about 40 Hz and below is the recipe for producing a transistor radio. |
- 15 posts total