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Holographic Soundstage ?

I would like to share my observation and hopefully get some input from people who have the same interest.

My system consist of Wharfedale Opus 3 , Krell KRC-3 preamp, Krell KSA 150 amp, Chord Qutest DAC and a computer with JCAT USB EX running Roon/with LPSU from HDPlex.
I mainly like holographic soundstage and would be able to achieve a very good 3D soundstaging with my current Krell setup.
I decided to try out tube amp a couple days ago because I read through the internet and everybody told me that tube amp always have better holographic soundstage and 3D imaging comparing to SS amp.
So I order a Raven Blackhawk MK3 from Raven audio with 45 days home trial just to try it out. I was expecting a very holographic soundstage that will blow my Krell out of the water.
Well, I was so WRONG. The Krell combo actually has a deeper and wider soundstage comparing to the Raven.
The Raven also has some very weak bass comparing to the Krell which is more punchy and tonally rich textured bass.
I cannot understand why it happens. I am always under the impression that tube amp will always provide more holographic soundstage. Obviously, In my set up the Krell is superior when it come to 3 dimensionality.

I will keeping trying out the Raven Blackhawk in the next couple of weeks and if things are not improved. I am ready to return the Raven and perhaps trying out the other tube amps (or solid state amps) that can beat the Krell combo.

If any one has some idea of such a product, please let me know. I am looking for an upgrade right now.

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pwerahera
123 posts
 
I am familiar with Krell KSA 150. I know what you mean by  " Krell combo actually has a deeper and wider soundstage comparing to the Raven." I use Krell KST 100 so that I don't have to put up with heat from KSA 150 due to class A bias. KST 100 also gives a 3D imaging, may not be as good as KSA 150.
I want to know what kind of software you use. For example, I use "The Ultimate Demonstration Disc," from Chesky Records to compare speakers, amps, etc., including one track for holographic imaging. I also have a number classical and jazz CDs/LPs that gives holographic imaging. However, it is highly dependent on the recording. If it is not in the recording, then audio chain cannot reproduce such imaging. I am curious what CDs/LPs you use for testing holographic imaging.
fiesta75
1,378 posts
 
Well since all you changed was the amp, either be patient or go back to the Krell. Remember you're comparing 150 watts to a 20 watts! Your speakers are not efficient enough for that amp in my opinion. You will need to make several changes if you want to switch to a low powered tube amp, my recommendation is a more powerful tube amp. If not, you will need to make a lot of changes including new speakers. Basically, you will be starting from the beginning of your audio journey. 
invalid
1,208 posts
 
Why don't you just put a good 6sn7 tube preamp in front of the krell amp. I couldn't stand my krell ksa 300s amp with solid state preamps, I got an octal tube preamp and it is so much better. 

As far as great holographic speakers, I have apogee duetta 2's that are very holographic, but not quite as holographic as my polk sda speakers. The apogees do have better detail and tone than the polks.
gkr7007's avatar
gkr7007
154 posts
 
"If any one has some idea of such a product, please let me know. I am looking for an upgrade right now."

Don Sachs has introduced his Valhalla  integrated recently and it is a giant killer.  It can use a variety of power tubes and its signal tubes are those luscious 6sn7's. Huge soundstage and imaging.  And at around $4500 is a bargain to boot.  
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jjss49
6,612 posts
 
@gkr7007

have you read this thread?

with all due respect to don, i don’t think you are doing him any favors suggesting his valhalla to drive these dual 10 in woofers in the op’s wharfedales to replace a 150/300 wpc krell ksa150

i would say it is 50-50 proposition at very best that his 30 wpc unit will handle them properly...
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