Old Amps that can still Kick Butt

While I much prefer Audio Research products, I still use a Hafler 500 I built at my desk in my shop in 1974.  Recently checked over, the bias was adjusted and the amp pronounced perfect, and it sounds that way.  I am using it on the bottom end of my bi-amped Tympani I-C's, so it is not called upon to be full range, but it works just fine either way.  Not perfect in accuracy, but just fine.

The Adcom 535 I got around the same time runs my home office system, which I use when doing stuff like this.  Neither is as accurate as the Audio Research amps I use on the top end or such older amps as the D-150--wish I still had one of those!--but they run and run and run and never give me a problem.

So yes, some older amps are just fine.  This is not to say I would not buy a new amp given the $$ and desire, but since this is not a priority for me right now--fixing up my newly-purchased house is #1--I am not in the market.

But those two amps seem to do the job for over 40 years, so why complain?  What else do you use that is 40+ years old and works as well as it did when new?  Maybe a musical instrument, and of course my C-2, which needs constant attention, but that's about all I can think of.

Cheers!

@lou_setriodes

B&K EX442/ST-140
PS Audio 200C/CX
VSP Labs Trans Mos 150
Acoustat TNT120/200
Moscode 300
Berning EA230
Onix OA21/21s
Tandberg 3012/3012a

It’s been fun reading through this thread and seeing some blasts from the past.

I built a DH500 from a kit in 1985, then moved on to a New York Audio Labs Moscode 300 about 2 years later (that one’s a bit obscure, and was surprised to see it mentioned! I actually got to meet Harvey Rosenberg...a very colorful and interesting character, as so many of these high-end entrepreneurs are!). My next amp was a Distech LS-2 based on the B&K ST-140. Ironically, I just picked up one of the last of the B&K ST-140s for my son as a graduation gift....he’s gonna love it!

@knotscott / @lou_setriodes -     Did either of you ever perform any of the mods, to your Moscodes?                                         Great amp!

@knotscott / @lou_setriodes -     Did either of you ever perform any of the mods, to your Moscodes?     Great amp!

Other than changing some tubes, I didn't do anything else to mine.

Most of the amps listed here will sound fine at low volume. But if you want to blast they’ll get painful. The mark of a good system is one that sounds smooth and detailed (not brightness masquerading as detail) even at high volume.


The problem is caused by insufficient feedback. At low frequencies the feedback is fine, which is why they can play bass well. But as frequency is increased, the distortion goes up with it because the design lacks the Gain Bandwidth Product needed to support high levels of feedback at high frequencies. This results in harshness and brightness since that is how the ear perceives the higher ordered harmonics generated by the amp.

You can’t just add more feedback; you might exceed the phase margin of the amp, causing it to oscillate.


Its a compromise.


I have a lower powered Radio Shack amp that sounds fine as long as you don’t push it hard. It tends to make the 2nd harmonic as its primary distortion product and that masks a good deal of the higher orders. But at higher volume levels there isn’t enough lower ordered content to mask anymore- and so it gets harsh. But if I run speakers that have enough efficiency, the amp never gets to those volumes and it sounds fine.

Put another way, even though a lot of the amps mentioned so far can make quite a bit of power, matching the speaker to them (using an easier to drive speaker) is paramount to getting the most out of them.