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Who needs a Diamond Cantilever...? 💍

So suddenly, there seems to be a trend for Uber-LOMC cartridges released with Diamond Cantilevers...😱
As if the High-End MC cartridges were not already overpriced....?!
Orofon have released the MC-ANNA-DIAMOND after previously releasing the Limited Edition MC-CENTURY...also with Diamond Cantilever.
Then there’s the KOETSU BLOODSTONE PLATINUM and DYNAVECTOR KARAT 17D2 and ZYX ULTIMATE DIAMOND and probably several more.

But way back in 1980....Sony released a Diamond-Cantilevered version of its fine XL-88 LOMC Cartridge.
Imaginatively....they named this model the XL-88D and, because it was the most expensive phono cartridge in the world (costing 7500DM which was more expensive than a Volkswagen at the time)....Sony, cleverly disguised this rare beast to look EXACTLY like its ’cheap’ brother with its complex hybrid cantilever of "special light metal held by a carbon-fibre pipe both being held again by a rigid aluminium pipe".
The DIAMOND CANTILEVER on the 88D however......was a thing of BEAUTY and technological achievement, being formed from ONE PIECE OF DIAMOND including the stylus 🤯🙏🏽

I’ve owned the XL-88 for many years and recently discovered that it was my best (and favourite) cartridge when mounted in the heavy Fidelity Research S-3 Headshell on the SAEC WE-8000/ST 12" Tonearm around my VICTOR TT-101 TURNTABLE.
Without knowing this in advance.....I would not have been prepared to bid the extraordinary prices (at a Japanese Auction Site) that these rare cartridges keep commanding.
To find one in such STUNNING CONDITION with virtually no visible wear was beyond my expectations 😃

So how does it sound.....?
Is there a difference to the standard XL-88?
Is the Diamond Cantilever worth the huge price differential?
Is the Pope a Catholic....?

This cartridge simply ’blows my mind’...which is hard to do when I’ve had over 80 cartridges on 10 different arms mounted on two different turntables 🤯
As Syntax said on another Thread:-
When you have 2 identical carts, one regular cantilever and the other one with diamond cantilever (Koetsu Stones for example), the one with diamond cantilever shows more details, is a bit sharper in focus and the soundstage is a bit deeper and wider. They can sound a bit more detailed overall with improved dynamics
I’ll leave it at that for the time being. I will soon upload to YouTube, the sound comparisons between the two Sony versions on my HEAR MY CARTRIDGES THREAD.

But now I’ve bought myself a nightmarish scenario.......
There is no replacement stylus for this cartridge!
There is no replacement cantilever for this cartridge!
Each time I play records with it, I am ’killing’ it a bit more 🥴😥
If I knew how long I had left to live......I could program my ’listening sessions’ 🤪
But failing this.....I can’t help but feel slightly uncomfortable listening to this amazing machine.
128x128halcro
best-groove's avatar
best-groove
842 posts
 
I suppose your comment was aimed at the old discussion about Victor MC-L1000.

exactly

I wouldn’t hesitate to call on him when the need arrives.


certainly, all my cartridges and tonearms always go through his hands for a check.
I no longer send to anyone else, he did revive cartridges given for passed off by others that not even Christ with his famous miracles would have succeeded.
Of course, everything has a cost.
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rauliruegas
13,051 posts
 
@edgewear : That vintage top of the line Micro Seiki TT JC owns it, I don't know if today still has it.

Yes, it is a true beauty and was and is expensive unit.

R.
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rauliruegas
13,051 posts
 
Dear @edgewear : The cantilever build material and in specific diamond against boron needs a little " analysis ".

My take as been no design/build cartridge expert is as coming:

first define the overall cantilever functions that seems to me an " easy " task:

one of that functions is to hold the stylus tip and second ( could be others. ) and along the cartridge suspension is to follow the modulations/vibrations transmited by the stylus grooves riding and this function is way critical because the ideal is to do it/transmit those movements with out adding cantilever self vibrations/resonances.

That last point is impossible to achieve due not only to the strog forces generated during the stylus grooves ridding but because not even the diamond is a perfect non vibrational cantilever material and because each cantilever along the stylus and its fulcrum has a resonance frequency.

So those tiny grooves modulations is desired too be transmitted at fast as it can.

I don’t know if the synthetic diamond used in cantilevers has exactly the same characteristics than the real natural diamond but if we compare differences in between real natural diamond and boron those differences are not night and day ( both materials are away from other cantilever materials. ). Example:

hardness : D= 10 B= 9.3 transmision speed D=18,000 B=16,200

density D=2.41 B=3.5 Young Modulus D=1,050 B=656  ( in other studies says the density of boron is: 2.35. )

All those numbers comes from Namiki site. The biggest difference looks at stifness but the boron still is way superior to other materials but diamond and very good as use in cantilevers.

I can’t see that the build material in a cantilever with diamond or with boron can makes a big differences per sé and what we listen through either material is colored too by the cantilever shape and its length along the quality of the cartridge suspension and cartridge engine/motor.

I think that exist to many variables to confirm with out doubt the absolute superiority of sysnthetic diamond vs boron in cartridge cantilevers.

Well all those and what I posted before on this regards is my amateur opinion.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.


mijostyn's avatar
mijostyn
8,570 posts
 
Pretty good amateur opinion Raul.  This is what I came up with. The specific gravity of Boron is 2.34. This means that Boron is 2.34 times heavier than an equal volume of water. The specific gravity of diamond is 3.52! Diamond is significantly heavier than Boron. A Boron cantilever will have a lower effective mass and theoretically track better. This does not take into account the stiffness of the two materials. Both are very stiff but I believe diamond is stiffer. The stiffer material would provide more accurate transmission. In order to know which is superior in any given design I think you would have to build the cartridge both ways and subject it to testing. I have this itch that tells me the diamond is more of a marketing strategy than anything else. The manufacturers of some very fine cartridges seem determined to avoid using diamond cantilevers and I'm sure there is a reason. I was hoping jcarr could fill us in on it.
edgewear
543 posts
 
Agreed, I suspect the extra $4000 Koetsu charges for a diamond cantilever has everything to do with snob appeal and 'trophies for the rich' marketing tactics.
I've read somewhere that Namiki charges around $1000 for their diamond cantilever/stylus assembly, so the $1500 extra Ortofon charges for the MC Anna Diamond (with their Replicant 100 stylus, so probably not sourced from Namiki) over the regular version with boron cantilever seems more reasonable. Whether this translates to better sound is open to debate. Of course the reviewers say 'yes', but they're just the mouthpiece for the industry. They just as easily try to convince people that Koetsu's surcharge is also money well spent.

Sure enough, it would be most interesting to know why JC and - for example - AJ (van den Hul) never issued a model with diamond cantilever. They must surely have considered this. I recently made direct contact with AJ about another matter, so perhaps I'll get the chance to ask him about this. And hopefully JC will take the bait here....!

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