2. tech-talk
  3. 169525-140

System building; a meditation

System building; a meditation

This is an offshoot of a posting I made in a different thread; that is, what is one’s approach to building a system out of various components that maximizes the sonic attributes of the combination of particular components?There’s been some push-back on “tweaks” but leave that to the side for now. How does one select what components to include in a system, putting to one side budgetary constraints? (the budget thing can be solved in several ways, including through used and through a deliberate strategy to acquire certain components over time that achieve a certain result- my point being, if it weren’t simply a constraint of capital, how does one choose?)

There seem to be a few rules that we abide by- the relationship of amp to speaker being fundamental. The choice of front end –from DIY digital to high end analog is also a choice, but I’ll be agnostic in this regard even though I came up through the LP and still regard it as the mainstream medium of choice, simply because of the wealth of material in older records.

How do people choose the combinations of equipment they employ? Is it happenstance, the gradual upgrading of each component to a high standard or some other benchmark for what the system is supposed to do that necessitates certain choices?

For what it is worth, I don’t endorse one single approach; I went from electrostat listening (including ribbon tweets and subs) to horns, sort of (Avantgardes plus subs) and SET as one choice, but have heard marvelous systems using larger, relatively inefficient dynamic set ups (Magico; Rockport, TG, etc.) combined with big solid state power that left a very positive impression.

How do you sort through the thicket? It isn’t just specs, and listening within your system to evaluate is an ideal, but I’m opening this up to system building in general—what approach do you take? I’m not sure there is a single formala, but thought it worth exploring since it seems to be an undercurrent in a lot of equipment changes without addressing the “why?” of it or how one makes these choices.

I know that we are mired in a subjective hobby, and almost every system is different, even if the components are the same in a different room, but thought this might be an interesting topic for discussion. If not, the lack of responses will prove me wrong. I don’t have a single answer to this FWIW.


128x128whart
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
… Have you ever seen a passage of music analyzed on an oscilloscope for input and output integrity? Nope, you haven’t. And square waves at fixed frequencies make for easy measurements but they don’t emulate music. I will skip right over the fact that many amplifiers and preamps that measure as "state of the art" on the test bench don’t sound "right".
I have seen Dirac Live.
and
I have seen other room correction S/W.

and… I have seen before and after impulse response from group delay corrections of speakers.

^They^/^Those^/^Them^ usually sound more right than wrong.

Or is that something different?

They are all doing a “signal integrity” by comparing a known signal, to what is coming out of the complete system, and then altering the system digitally to compensate for the system’s response as well as the room’s response. 
sbank's avatar
sbank
3,379 posts
 
Fantastic thread with so many angles to consider!

For me, some of the keys include:
- Aspirational reference points
- Room/gear and gear/gear matching
- Step-by-step improvements

As more specifically articulated above, more goosebump moments is what I'm after ultimately. By listening to as many rooms and systems as possible, I've noted which design approaches and gear I find most moving. my touchpoints include fleshed out instruments and voices that approach 3D, lively dynamics and tonal accuracy...those cues that tell you "whoa! I hear real musicians in that room". Each decision strives to push further down a path that brings me closer to that goal.

IMHO, speaker design is the big kahuna with incredibly wide ranges of strengths/limitations/priorities/needs. You've first got to decide what type of speakers will take you where you want to go and choose your favorite that you can afford that will work well in your room and with your other gear. So focus on speakers first, ensuring room fit and a compatible amp, even if the initial amp isn't your be-all-end-all. 
Put more of your source investment where you have most of your beloved media if you have both analog and digital. 

Like many of you, I've had to upgrade components individually over time for budgetary reasons. I try to think through each purchase to:
- Leapfrog the prior component further towards my references & goals
- Head towards more transparency; more of what's in the recording will ultimately be what you're after, not hiding it. If the trumpet don't bite, something ain't right!  The point made about not getting trapped offsetting is a good one(e.g. a warm speaker with a cool amp). That's a recipe for disaster. 
- Make incremental steps large enough in impact to be worthwhile. Hold off on sideways moves and wait until you can swap in something you're confident has a real chance to be a major upgrade.

Listening to as much gear as possible in as many real rooms as possible will strengthen your ability to identify which design choices make a stronger personal connection. Used gear purchases "as home demos" is best of all, often at not much or any cost. Given the state of COVID & retail, it might be your only option. Maximizing synergy in your room toward your goals with your other gear is what it's all about.  

Cheers,
Spencer

  
douglas_schroeder
3,281 posts
 
Variety is my solution to the vain attempt to build a uniquely superior audio system. 
holmz's avatar
holmz
2,328 posts
 
@douglas_schroeder  ;)
tomic601's avatar
tomic601
12,915 posts
 
Let me ponder the winemakers intent..as i sip a nice oaky Chard…out of wait for it……not a wine glass…but a charred oak cup….

Chalice..


More to discover