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Underpowered?

Hi guys.  Newbie here asking for advice. 

I recently purchased a pair of B&W 702 Signature (8Ω, 30-300W, 90 dB) to replace my old faithful 683s (8Ω, 20-200W, 90 dB).  I am running them with a McIntosh MA252 (100W into 8Ω, 160W into 4Ω).  I purchased them thinking they would complete my end-game system.  However, my excitement turned into disappointment when I realized the lows were somewhat lacking.  For all their faults, the 683s had a great dynamic low kick (no sub) that I was looking to take one step further.  Unsurprisingly, the highs and mids on the 702s were indeed more detailed and separation was clearer, but I couldn't get over the uninspiring lows.  I found myself listening at higher volumes chasing for that bass oomph.  Neither playing with the EQ at the source nor the amp was satisfactory.  So, I did the research that perhaps I should've done before purchasing the 702s and found out they are quite power hungry despite the specs being similar to the 683s.  I emailed B&W and McIntosh and they agreed the amp is probably underpowered for the 702s.  B&W described the sound of an underpowered speaker as one lacking low response and details, which is spot on. McIntosh suggested the MA352 (200W into 8Ω, 320W into 4Ω).

Of note, I love the MA252 and really wish there was a way to make this work.  I don't need a DAC/streamer/etc so I'm happy to put all my money on better sound vs tech features.  But I also think the speakers sound amazing even when somewhat underpowered and I'm considering upgrading to a MA352, Michi X3, Hegel 390.  Another option could be to get a sub? But I feel that would defeat the purpose of having a 3way standing speaker and then I might as well get a pair of bookshelf speakers (805 D4s, LS50 metas?).

So what do you guys think? Is it normal for a speaker that's rated 30-300W to be underpowered with a 100W amp?? What would you do:

  1. Sell the 702s and look for a better match for my MA252?

  2. Upgrade the MA252 (MA352? Michi X3? NAD 33?)?

  3. Get a subwoofer?

I would really appreciate your thoughts/advice!

dridel
bubbagump
8 posts
 

1. Have they had a sufficient break-in period???  2. As someone else suggested, you may want to place an ad here or on Craigslist to see if someone has a higher-powered quality amp who wishes to audition the 702's before pulling the trigger on them.   Not a big fan of subs for 2 channel towers, prefer them with HT.  A $7500 pair of towers shouldn't require a sub-woofer if sufficiently powered and broken in, unless in a huge room...

steve59's avatar
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steve59
1,780 posts
 

 second amp to drive the woofers. use the pre outs to a mac amp thats rated with 50% more power than the current amp and slave it to the woofers.

ctsooner
2,480 posts
 

If you have played with placement and still aren’t happy, maybe it’s time to move the speakers. Go audition others with your amp. 100w that can double into 4ohms is plenty powerful for most speakers in a reasonable room. The Mac gear isn’t my favorite, but it’s a premium amp that does very listen wrong (for the price I just like some other gear better in My system). I have friends who own Vandersteen’s and Wilson’s who love Mac with it. I’ve never heard that amp sound bad,  nor unpowered ever. 
 

adding a sub just adds more to the equation. In the right situation they can be awesome, but in you case why throw more money if you are chasing your tail to get  better bass from a pair of speakers. Multiple ways to fix something that shouldn’t need fixing.  Good luck.  

fiesta75
1,378 posts
 

I’m impressed, some excellent suggestions! You have your work cut out for you, this will keep you busy for a while I would imagine. Take your time and listen closely. I would start with imhififan’s idea first just to eliminate the possibility of driver phase error. Nothing else will help much if this is the problem! Good luck.

sgreg1
612 posts
 

I don’t know anything about your Mac amp but could you buy another of what tou have and run them mono or bi-amped?

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