What are your general thoughts of B&W speakers

Rhljazz,

The only ionic tweeter I have heard is the acapella. I know of no other tweeter to sound as good. It's so pure. Stunning clarity and extension. But the problem is mating it to the lower drivers.

IMHO the acapella fails because the tweeter is so good. The xover just shows up the difference in speed. Just like the subs on the old hybrid Martin Logan's failed at keeping up with the ESL upper panel.

A speaker is all about balance. So maybe as you say a silk dome sounds better in a speaker, but probably because it mates better with the other drivers.

But here we are again discussing the finer points of exotic tweeters when we have people saying "I wouldn't have em for free..."

For all we know these types of opinions are about the lowest budget B&W when we are talking about the diamond tweeters which are only found in the reference series. To post your opinion you must add which model you are discussing and what you are using it with.

Mapman,

I guess deffuse is really what I mean when comparing the MBL to some other designs. Especially if compared to the AG Trio. Not being palpable is my point.

Phasey is probably not the correct term. I associate MBL with that thin but airy sound as if phase or a form of comb filtering causes there not to be weight.

To explain the sonic difference i mean, take the Sehneiser HD800 headphones and compare them to the Audeze LCD3 headphones. The HD800 has a detailed air/thinness where as the LCD3 are rich, very detailed and organic by having much more flesh on the bone. Thicker sounding I guess.

Chad,

Ag trios (high efficiency horns) and omni low efficiency mbl are of course
as different as can be, so hard to compare. The sound radiation pattern
of an omni is diffuse pretty much by defnition, but i would say the sound
Set up right is not. I have heard other full range horns but not ag and
compared. Not
nearly as much diffence in sound necessarily as design might lead one to
expect, all things considered.

I heard mbl 111e once set up optimally. I heard weight differences from
rtr, vinyl and digital, but not a lack overall. Specific recording quality of
the
material played seemed to be the main factor, but sohrce device in the
system used anoher to some degree.

No doubt, omnis seem to require lots of power compared to others to
perform best. I have observed that over time with my ohms. Having lots
of "meat on the bones" is one of my favorite terms to describe
them these days using 500 w/ch icepower amps. Larger higher end B&W
speakers i have heard are similar in regards to having good meat on the
bone, at least with the right amps, as mentioned.

Hi Mapman,

Please don't think I'm am saying the MBL is bad. Although I doubt there is much value for what you get. Placement with omi speakers and dipoles can create problems.

Surely all things being equal, reference speakers should(!) pretty much sound the same. Because hopefully they are not editing what is passing through them.

That being said as I mentioned in my post comparing the Sehneiser HD800 to the Audeze LCD3, you would not confuse these reference headphones sonically. They sound very different.

You would have to be mad to say the HD800s are rubbish and utterly bonkers to say the LCD3 are rubbish. You could say the HD800s are tilted upwards towards spacial cues and air. My experience of the MBL. I have heard the Graz ribboned Apogee Diva sound this way too when the ribbons where not run in.

So I guess once we know a particular trait in a speaker (once placement etc are taken into account) then matching of auxiliary equipment becomes as important.

The B&W 801d and the 802d mated with the big Classe reference 400 monos ( as used in Abbey road studios) sounds balanced. But I have also used the 802d in Studios using Bryston with a much less success. Leaving the 802d sounding strained and metallic.

I have a friend who uses the 802d with 2x CJ 350 SS amps which sound very creamy and smooth. So what we have to say is the B&w D speakers are very transparent and rely heavily on the quality of the amp driving it.

Personally I like B&W speakers. Good honest performance.

"You could say the HD800s are tilted upwards towards spacial cues and air. My experience of the MBL."

No doubt, spatial cues and air (when set up properly in the right room, not an easy task with the larger models)a are the main distinguishing characteristic of mbl. Its a subjective love it or hate it kind of thing as is much of home audio.

OHMs are a much better value and more practical for most IMHO. They excel at coherency and delivering weight to the music in an effortless manner along with all the rest, although a fairly hefty amp is still required, at least for the larger models. OHMs are being marketed and distributed in Germany, mbls home turf, these days. I wonder how that is going?