Law of Accelerated Returns

@mijostyn

To your point, I have heard only one setup EVER that did the 3-d soundstage to the extent you describe...and I have heard 100’s over the years I would estimate.

As I have alluded to on occasion in past threads here, that was a demo of an all mbl system with mbl 111a speakers set up at then United Home Audio in Annapolis Junction, MD, in a showroom optimally constructed for the purpose unlike anyone is likely to have at home, probably over 10 years ago.

Same system at shows, less optimally setup...back with the pack.

So I have seen what it takes and factor that into what I do at home to the extent needed for me to be happy in lieu of setting up a custom room like that and going full omni. Something I greatly appreciated but do not need to get my endless hours of enjoyment from my music at home. THis ain’t the Olympics and I have no preconception about being the best in the world. Too much trouble! But never should be too much trouble to at least learn from the best and apply what you learn as you may. :^)

My system(s): Sound Chaser | Virtual Listening Room (audiogon.com)

I have heard only one setup EVER that did the 3-d sound stage

Same here it was the Chicago Symphony Orchestra and I have given up on trying replicate that sound years ago. I can not replicate Orchestra Hall in Chicago at my home in the burbs. I have tried and my gear and room have their moments. 

@onhwy61 I just think the concept of accelerated returns in audio reproduction is false. I find it interesting that nobody has offered actual examples of it happening.

Your thoughts are 100% correct.

So, that nobody has (or can, or ever will) offered actual examples of accelerated marginal returns is irrelevant. 

However - should there be honest examples provided they would be similar to what is sometimes loosely known as a Black Swan event

@jerryg123

Well I should qualify that the mbl demo I heard was a full scale symphony orchestra recording and you could locate the players exactly in a 3-D area about 24-30’ wide at the immediate front of the listener I would estimate and similar depth as I recall however the sides were tapered to maybe only 5’ or so at the rear, so NOT parallel and highly treated with curtains and whatever was used behind those. So sit in row 1 at the symphony and shrink the size of the stage down to that size and that’s what you had, with all the players locations easily triangulated by the ears within that space. It was awesome but still obviously a scaled down version of a live symphony in terms of physical dimensions though SPL levels were comparable.

I will say though, that with a good symphony recording, if I close my eyes at home, I can convince myself what I hear is similar to what I would hear at The Meyerhoff Symphony Hall in Baltimore or Carnegie Hall (in NY), maybe a third to two-thirds of the way back in most cases, depending. Those are the two quality venues of that scale that I am most familiar with. Achieving that was one of my goals and that makes me very happy and content! If I sit close enough with the Ohm wide-dispersion pseudo omnis, maybe front row if the recording permits.

Also worth mentioning that the guy who designs the Ohm Walsh speakers that I fancy, John Strohbeen, is also a classical musician who frequents Carnegie Hall and says he uses what he hears there to "voice" his speakers. Done very well I would say! Ohms are the poor man’s mbls. They were designed to work well fairly close to walls in most any room most people might actually have though YMMSV.