Tweaks, money pit or real value?

Very great choices it seems to me...Thanks for youre interesting post...

 

 

I will only add  for those who dont have money to do that like me, that it is possible for someone without money to do the same thing, or nearly approximate it, inspired by all this precise tweaks you just described...

Happily for sure, because we dont have all the luxury of this excess money......

34 SR HFT amount to near 2000 bucks...

2 pair of hallographs: 3000 bucks...

Add to that all others costly devices you described...And guess what is the cost?

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I dont doubt that these "tweaks" work at all...I know they work...

But it is possible to create a room with peanuts costs...

For example what the hallograph "form" teach us?

It teach us that modifying the shear velocity of waves on some pressure zone location we will enjoy a more "atmospherical" diffusion... This is TRUE...I created my own diffusers with Helmholtz method...

Then there exist simple means to do this at NO cost... Less esthetical though... 😊😊

It is the same thing for all other "tweaks" or "embeddings controls" which is the term i prefer to use or which i prefer to call them, to let in their sleep slumber the "snake oil" hunters or tool obsessed measuring groups...

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For a dedicated room, rejoice all "poor" audiophiles, i buld one at NO cost...Oufff 160,000 bucks... It work because if my sound is not the best there is in the world, i enjoy a sound quality with a 500 bucks system over the roof....

Read about acoustic and psycho-acoustic not about price tag brand name tweaks... But forget esthetic save if you are very crafty ....

For sure my post is adressed to the desesperate hopeless poor audiophiles....

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One thing is very important: the only luxury in audio is a dedicated room to conduct listening experiments and where tu put your devices, not the price tag of the system and the price tag of the "tweaks"...

An Helmholtz diffuser can be made with empty toilet paper rolls... 😁😊

 

Here is what I use: Two pairs of Hallographs to focus and gain ambiance with my typical box type dynamic speakers, 34 SR HFTs throughout the room and on speakers which adjust tonal balance and also disperse early reflections, boxed mounted and hanging Acoustic Fields foam absorption panels, SR blue outlet duplexes and three blue fuses on multiple amps, various types of footers, SR Mig Sx under one stereo amp, Stillpoints and one set of old Aurios under equipment with a Townshend seismic sink under a VPI TNT 6.

Stands and cabling are considered tweeks by some. The biggest tweek was building a custom high end audio listening room for $160,000.

 

Has anyone had their hearing checked lately?? Couldn't we consider THAT a tweak too?

The Hallographs are superior to toilet paper roll Helmholtz diffusers and probably any typical Helmholtz diffuser.  I needed them in my prior home which did not have a custom built listening room.  If I purchase Von Schweikert speakers, I probably won't need them at all.  Same with speaker HFTs.   I have friends with $500K audio systems in their living rooms with windows behind them that sound very good as well.  Another friend has only footer tweeks in a $15K system that sounds fabulous (RM9 amp Mac C20 preamp, VPI Scout/Dynavector 20X2H, etc/Von Schweikert export V35 speakers).  

I just wanted to point out that 2/3rds of the tweeks I tried were either ineffective or not worth the money.   I've been using tweeks for over 40+ years.  

About my custom listening room-I can afford it and everyone who ventures in to hear my music loves it and wishes they had such a great listening room.

I do not say they are equal in results...

I only suggest that a room acoustic and devices dont need to be costly...

I know this why?

Because when i listen my 500 bucks system in my dedicated room i am sure that your system is superior to mine... I am not so stupid... 😁😊

My point is more subtle and difficult to admit for some but my system is not so far away from yours than what you think...I am in no way envious or frustrated...Acoustic is the key and it is my most important discovery in audio... 😁😊

If i can enjoy my system room way better than my 8 headphones now in my drawer for good this means something no?

And my point was not to say that my low cost Helmholtz diffusers are not so much behind your Hallograph than what you think , BECAUSE they work on the shear velocity of waves diffusion on some location and price tag and acoustic principle has nothing in common anyway. and price tag dont determine the results...

By the way i use no brand name costly "tweaks" i created most of my devices homemade and with a method... Some device give us something that nothing else will do...You cannot replace vibrations control under a speaker by replacing the speaker by a more costly one generally... For sure a 500,000 bucks speakers nay have vibrations controls included in his design...

Optimizing SMALL room acoustic is essential not a icing on a cake in most cases most of the time...

It is the relation between the system and the room who give us acoustical factor like "listener envelopment" and source width ratio LEV/ASW not the electronical design by itself alone...

And designing a room is more important than the price tag of the components..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The Hallographs are superior to toilet paper roll Helmholtz diffusers and probably any typical Helmholtz diffuser. I needed them in my prior home which did not have a custom built listening room.

If I purchase Von Schweikert speakers, I probably won’t need them at all. Same with speaker HFTs.

Perhaps yes the sound quality will be so good you feel that way and you will perceive it so...

But buying ready made "tweaks" is not FINE TUNING A ROOM...

A tweak is not an acoustic method by itself.... Learning how to tune a room supposed a method...It is not buy and plug here...

The relation speakers/room ask for an acoustical optimization process that bear no relation with the design or price tag of a specific speakers... All speakers enter in a relation to the room in their own way and each specific room help and/or impede some emerging acoustical cues... Optimizing this relation ask for a fine tuning of the room that cannot be solved by a general ready made product alone even by many...

I called my grid of Helmholtz resonators and Helmholtz diffusers a "mechanical equalizer" why?

Because it modify the room pressure zone distribution to adapt the room to the specs and properties of the speakers FOR YOUR EARS which are also specific...

A small room acoustic is not an amphiteater room acoustic... This is very different room for different use...

Acoustic room treatment and mechanical control are always necessary save in a completely designed room by an acoustician for some specific speakers...but here the cost is stratospheric...A good acoustician here can use Helmholtz resonators in the wall and diffusers at some spot to help the room in his service to the chosen speakers...

There exist no miraculous speakers at any price who sound the same in ALL room....treated and non treated, controlled or not controlled... this is a common place fact...

 

I apologize if i seem rude....

My deepest respect to you

I hired an acoustician and followed his construction requirements as well as eliminating the need for bass traps by building them into the wall (including activated carbon filters between studs). The walls are 16" thick with no openings (doors are hinged and same design 17" thick). The ceiling and side walls have wall mounted acoustic absorption paneling, the floor is a 12" thick, steel reinforced 3000 psi slab. The hallographs are necessary not as a diffuser but as a focusing device-the Legacy Focus speakers tend to be narrow in soundstage and imaging. The Hallographs permit adjustable wider seating with enhanced ambiance. My Signature IIIs have a rear tweeter and have more ambient rich highs than the Focuses. The designer took into account the 6 -12" woofers in his order of carbon bass trap filters and that would include my proposed upgrade to the Von Schweikert VR9 SE Mkll speakers. I recognize very modest distinct benefits of 29 of the 34 SR HFTs I implement; however, the four HFT 2.0s on the bass portion of the speakers and the HFT-X on the center front wall are truly beneficial and very obvious in their affect in my tuned room. My choice of finished cherry plywood on all interior surfaces required more adjustment than room construction. I chose not to implement quadradic diffusion for reasons of loss of room area (the acoustician suggested 12" to 14" deep front and rear wall diffusion) and cost of real wood products (not the cheap/cheaper GIK products).

Enjoying one’s music in any system, even in a miniscule cost is the object of listening to music. My second audio system cost me under $5k in my good but not acoustically treated living room. It is better sounding than 95% of all music listeners I’m sure. Schiit electronics can be really cheap and sound very good. If the listener enjoys what they hear, that’s all that’s necessary. Audiophiles tend to gravitate toward improvements in their sound system and not concentrate on the music. Most music listeners today are satisfied with streaming music on their phones with earbuds.