SQ or performance?


In classical music, how much does the sound quality influence your enjoyment of a particular piece?  I find it plays a large part. A recording is an artifact in itself.  There are many factors which contribute to the final product. And even a great performance can be sabotaged by poor engineering, poor pressing, poor microphone placement and the like. Conversely, a mediocre performance can be attractive to us because of sterling acoustics.   
In “historical” recordings we may allow for bad sound, but in contemporary performances the sound can have  a significant bearing on our perspective.
Also, our appreciation of a given performance can be affected by other factors.  For example, if we grew up loving a certain version, all others may suffer by comparison in our view.
 

 

rvpiano

are we a music lover first, or a sound lover first?

True question....

Music flow through sound but is never only sound or mostly sounds...

Why the deaf Beethoven could wrote music if not?

Music is a state of the spirit manifested in our conciousness through our body ..,

But when this is said there is also the pure power of sound...

Sound quality is a realm in itself, and well recorded sound can be therapeutic, binaural sound or precise frequencies...For example this album of powerful therapeutic music is not listenable on most audio system/room if they are not able to give a good acoustic results...

This is not  so much music but powerful sonic  remedy for the soul/body...I used it against anxiety...Try it if you suffer...Better than any drug, no secondary effects...Work in minutes...

I did not recommend in  particular any other compositions of this man , Jonathan Goldman but this one....He succeed at the highest degree possible here...Others pieces are more relaxing or meditative pieces this one is a  "drug" for curing soul disease...

I experimented his therapeutic power and also it is one of the best test for a system because it is very difficult to have this  sound right... Delicate Chimes and pulsating frequencies wall with 2 voices chanting a mantra (Christ name)...

 

Thank you, rvpiano, for this post, and thank you—again!—Herr Magister (Mahgister?) for your many contributions to it. A few humble comments of my own, then.

First, what we seek in listening to a piece of music is an ability to perceive what is in the score; I hesitate to say it, but "what the composer intended to express" (I'm well aware of the dubiousness of the notion of musical "expression"; there's a vast literature on this). The point here, though, is that one must be able to hear how counterpoint interacts with the main melodic line, how the "ground bass" integrates the whole, and, well, many other things. But these "things" are transparent, or at any rate accessible to perception, when a fine performance articulates them. On the other hand, a bad recording can submerge such careful expression in noise: tape hiss, bad acoustics, poor microphone placement, etc. 

My point: both performance and recording engineering aim at essentially the same objective: transparency of the original musical conception.

Therefore, the opposition—good recording or good performance?—is really a misconception. What the listener will be most delighted by is the musical ideas in the composition. These must first of all be communicated by the performer (pianist, conductor and orchestra, whatever). Then, they must be captured on the recording. 

For what it's worth, I passionately disagree with those who espouse Holt's Law, or whatever it was. No, great performance (that is, interpretation) and great sonics are not in inverse relation! There are in fact many recent performances of many great works that are both well-recorded and brilliantly interpreted. I might almost compare this to the "art" of translation. In general, recent translations from German, French, Spanish, Italian, Russian are better than earlier translations. The standards translators are held to these days are far more rigorous than was once the case. That being said, there are nevertheless many old translations (Kemp Smith's of Kant's First Critique; Schlegel's translations of Shakespeare into German) that have never been bettered. One needs TASTE to discern what is important here; it's not just a binary matter of technology (recording) vs. artistry (performance).

Mahgister: you mentioned Pogorelich's performances of Scriabin. Do you know the DVD of his Bach-Scarlatti-Beethoven recital in the Veneto Villa Caldogno (and the Eckartsau Castle in Austria)? If not, seek it out on eBay, where it can be had for a few dollars. Fantastic! (Full disclosure: Pogorelich was part of my past in an important way.)

Thank you, rvpiano, for this post, and thank you—again!—Herr Magister (Mahgister?) for your many contributions to it.

I add my thanks to your owns for this great thread idea from rvpiano....

My pseudo come from latin, with a letter interpolated to distinguish me from others who take the same name, which means school teacher in Latin... I study latin and greek in my teen age...

And i worked as a preceptor for young men...I miss young people because i am retired...

One needs TASTE to discern what is important here; it’s not just a binary matter of technology (recording) vs. artistry (performance).

My impression are simple: no well recorded only good interpretation will beat some badly recorded masterpiece... Then like you justly said it is a matter of MUSICAL judgement and this has nothing to do with sound...For me because i am not a musician at all it is a matter of pulsating heart reaction to music, some music put me in an ectasy so great that anything else fall short ....No opposition from me then...We all like a well recorded album and artist... But some of the more miraculous pieces of music i ever listened to are awful sonically...But the effect on me is like near death experience sometimes...

I posted about a tanbur player in this thread above whose recording are among the most awful i own but it is IRREPLACEABLE artistry from an archangel really, if someone dare to pass sound barrier to enter this sanctuary where music become prayer...

Mahgister: you mentioned Pogorelich’s performances of Scriabin. Do you know the DVD of his Bach-Scarlatti-Beethoven recital in the Veneto Villa Caldogno (and the Eckartsau Castle in Austria)? If not, seek it out on eBay, where it can be had for a few dollars. Fantastic! (Full disclosure: Pogorelich was part of my past in an important way.)

Pogorelich plays at the peak of piano playing...We cannot discard ANY of his album

He is a wounded god....

Thanks for this Scarlatti recommendation played to the perfection....

Some rare artist cannot be compared on a line with others, these few refuse to be compared, i think Pogorelich is in this rare band of supremum artists...

I am curious like others here though about the reason of his importance in your life...If you want to speak about that.... Anyway i will respect silence too...

My deepest respect to you...

 

 

 

I forgot to say that for sure you are right , there is no linear relation between sound quality and interpretation , the recording engineer is an artist too or not...

No, great performance (that is, interpretation) and great sonics are not in inverse relation!

In general I'll choose an excellent performance over excellent fidelity.. But it really depends on my mood. Sometimes I want to hear what a particular group of singers & musicians have wrought.. Sometimes I want to dive into the soundstage, relish the sheer lack of distortion, and glory in the tone quality & slam. In any case, though, spitty sibilants drive me nuts.

The most potent musical  drug in the world is reserved for a  ceremonial listening not a daily habit for me save Bach for example ...In particular if the recording is very bad....But i never listen Bruckner even well recorded casually in a distracted manner...

I too like good recorded music...But music performance beat always sound at the end ...But when an interpret is so great spiritually and transcend recording bad technique i listen to him in a ceremonial way never in a distracted day to day basis... I prefer daily to listen good recordings like you ...But almost all my albums are if not good, acceptable...Jazz, classical, Indian and Persian etc 

For the sibilants it is a problem of your audio system, not from the recording...I think...

I own 9000 albums NONE are sibilant now...But they were some years ago...

8 years ago before i choose the right components and before room acoustic i listened to sibilants but in headphones at this times...After changing components i never hear once again...

 

In general I’ll choose an excellent performance over excellent fidelity.. But it really depends on my

mood. Sometimes I want to hear what a particular group of singers & musicians have wrought.. Sometimes I want to dive into the soundstage, relish the sheer lack of distortion, and glory in the tone quality & slam. In any case, though, spitty sibilants drive me nuts.