PC-Audio vs. High-end CD Player-GAME OVER

I did A/B, many times. For example my Cosecant against an $8k Meridian G08 at a dealer. A room full of people were shocked that the Cosecant killed it, including the owner. The 808 (which is an upsampling player)was another story. You could hear a little deeper in with the 808, but didn't have the pretty sound the Cosecant has. I would have loved to see Crimson against the 808. But either way, these are $8k and $12k respectively. Worth the money after what heard? No freakin way!

Even the single box dSC 8pi player at $15K outperforms the Meridian 808 Signature. Of course, the EMM Labs Signature betters the dCS. This is reported somewhere here on Audiogon - "Blind Shootout in San Diego". So that's why I asked you what your reference is. Now I know!

I have very nice equipment from VTL and my DAC. Wavelength is tops, and there is no sonic compromise (from an audiophile standard) with ANY of Gordon's DACs. Give one a listen first, then come talk to me.

Oh, I am sure!

Regards,
Alex

I think we should also take price into consideration. Now I have not had the pleasure to own or listen to Alex's NWO CD transports, and have no doubut that they are excellent.

However, many people are hearing no comparable differences between, say a Meridian 808 ($13000) vs. Wavelength Cosecant ($3500) + existing iMac (new ones can be had for around $1500). Even with external hard drives, we're talking less than $6,000 for a system that is indistinguishable (or better) than a $13,000 cdp.

Another thing to consider is that many many people simply are not able to spend over 10 grand for a CD player, but pretty much all of them have PCs or Macs - and have the option of spending a couple grand on a very good DAC + external HDD to get a performance unthinkable by spending similar amount of money on a single box CDP.

And all of this is *before* considering the enormous advantage of ease of having thousands of songs at your fingertips.

So, again, I agree that APL NWO, or other cost-no-object CDPs may still be better than the PC-audio setups, but how much difference are we really talking about here? It's not like teenagers listening to mp3's just because they are super convenient at the huge expense of audio quality. People listening to uncompressed wav or lossless files are not merely sacrificing fidelity for convenience.

Also, only audiophiles say vinyl is not dead. Look around and see how many new music (including classical and jazz) are being issued in LP format. Vinyl is not dead only in the sense that there are niche producers re-issuing classics and producing excellent LP players.

Pschoi, the NWO is not a transport; it is a stand alone universal digital player. No need for DAC or preamp.

So, again, I agree that APL NWO, or other cost-no-object CDPs may still be better than the PC-audio setups,

That's it! Thank you!

but how much difference are we really talking about here?

Here is an experiment for you when time permits;

Get a $30K+ vinyl rig with the new AirTight PC-1 cartridge, buy the Bassface Swing Trio "Plays Gershwin" on vinyl that was recorded direct-to-disc. This LP comes as a bundle with an SACD inside that was recorded direct-to-DSD. So setup the vinyl rig and ANY PC-Audio/DAC combination of your choice, then A-B the two. Let me know if the PC-Audio/DAC surpasses the vinyl rig.

Oh sorry, I forgot, you can't even play SACD on the PC-Audio/DAC combo. :-)

Regards,
Alex

Thank you for pointing out that NWO is a CDP. Someday, I would love to hear one.

But again, you're using a $30K LP setup as a comparison. I never made any claims that a $30K LP (or dedicated CDP for that matter) will surpass the PC + DAC combo. My point is that if you spent the same, let's say, $5,000 on a PC + DAC vs. CDP, which would come out on top? What about $3,000 PC + DAC vs. CDP.

Anyway, when you think about it the CD will be dead if (a big if) the major studios determine that they are no longer making money off them, and if the on-line download market becomes big enough to make pressing CD's no longer worthwhile. And companies like Sony, Samsung, etc. stop making mass-market CDP's (or DVD players). So you can see that huge assumptions have to be made to declare that CD will be dead soon, and it will not matter a tiny bit to the studios whether there is an excellent PC+DAC setup...OR...whether there is a small manufacturer out there that makes fantastic CDPs for a small number of people. Unfortunately, what the audiophile market says will be irrelevant to the demise (or continued existence) of the CD medium.

Like Alex said, there currently is a 30K vinyl rig that will blow all CDs and SACD players away, in full production, and anyone with enough money can buy it. But that doesn't mean Deutsche Gramophone or Decca will come back issuing the new Berlin Phil or Metropolitan Opera recordings on LPs.

Wow, I was considering some Alps gear until I read this thread. ):

Computer and/or network based transports are the future.