Tube PHONO preamp interference - RFI, EMI, bad grounding?


Hello!

My tube phono is picking up interference most probably from the air. It's EAR yoshino 834p, using three 12AX7 tubes. It's sounds pretty amazing and I willing to try everything to keep it. 

Here is a sample of the sound - 

 

The rest of the setup is ARC LS16 mk1, Classe CA200, Chord Qutest, Technics SL1200 with Nagaoka MP200, Tannoys D700

I have tried many things already -

- grounding the phono to the preamp, grounding the phono to a socket, covering the phono with a pot, saucepan - no change

-plugging the phono preamp alone into an integrated (Bryston B60) and removing other stuff.

- the important part is I have taken the phono to two other places and it worked perfectly fine, even with the cheapes cables.

- I haven't had any problems with previous phono preamps which were all solid state. 

- if I unplug the turntable the signal fades to about 50%

- if I try different RCA cables, there's not much of a change even they are shielded (audioquest mackenzie, supra etc.)

- the signal also fades when I grab the cables. Also works if I grab or squeeze the output cables. 

- I have tried to wrap the cables into aluminum foil, I have noticed a difference but it's still unlistenable.

- I have tried pluging in a 5 meters long RCA output cable and walked with the phono preamp around the room. It's simply like carrying an antenna. Placing the phono on the floor helps but again, the interference is still present. 

 

Do you have any suggestions what else to try? Is there some kind of grounding that would prevent the phono preamp acting like an antenna? 

I haven't tried a new set of tubes yet. 

I think the 12AX7 are simply too sensitive to all the mess in the air. The ARC LS16 preamp was catching the same signal very quietly when I took it's cover of. 

Thanks!

Filip

128x128filipm

@lewm 

So that 33 ohm resistor we see in the photo, which is in series between the threaded screw and the 3rd pin of the IEC, according to the OP, is either doing nothing or the chassis is floated by the 33 ohm resistor which I certainly agree is not the best idea. The OP has dropped out so we may never know. 

We knew this days ago when the OP confirmed the chassis is 33ohms above ground. He measured it. 

@atmasphere and I have been trying over the past few days to guide him in the right direction - ground the chassis and ground lug to 0 and leave the circuit ( board ) floating at 33 ohms.

 

 

Ok. My idea that floating the ground lug above ground along with the audio circuit is unconventional at best, based on what Atma wrote and my own measurements of two phono stages at my house. So I expect the ground lug on the EAR is in contact with the chassis. The ground lug is at chassis potential. Therefore I assume the IEC ground must not be directly connected to the chassis. (If it is, the 33 ohm resistor does nothing.) So, the 33 ohm resistor floats the whole device, chassis included, with respect to the IEC. That IS strange.

@lewm - I have followed and appreciated your investigation and effort to make sense of the evidence, and I agree this is strange. The EAR has rave reviews, and it just seems improbable that Tim de Paravicini with his reputation would make this kind of mistake. Perhaps in the repairs to this EAR the OP talked about something wasn't put back together correctly - or it is a manufacturing defect and they got it backwards in production and put the resistor in the wrong place.

My Creek Integrated is wired up like atmasphere and dover were saying is the correct way, and my other phono stages are either battery powered or do not have an IEC third prong (powered by wall wart) - so I have own nothing personally to verify with - but you mentioned the Manley Steelhead -  which in its current iteration has three ground connectors, and they do make a distinction between circuit and chassis ground, with separate ground lugs, and allow the user to make their own choice about the grounding scheme; though I strongly suspect they would not leave the chassis floating in any of them. So I think there is definitely something to what you were talking about at least for some phono stages. 

 

The EAR has rave reviews, and it just seems improbable that Tim de Paravicini with his reputation would make this kind of mistake.

Tim passed away (RIP) about 2 years ago. The simple explanation is this unit was built incorrectly.

Indeed, if the 33 ohm resistor was in series between the IEC and the ground lug, on the one hand, and the PCB ground, leaving everything but the PCB containing the audio circuit at earth ground, that would be OK. But I still don't think we've hit upon the primary cause of the noise that the OP recorded and included in his initial post. (I realize Dover said all this before me.)