Transients hurting my ears on hifi solid state amps


I've looked at many discussions on listening fatigue and similar topics, but haven't really found the answer to the specific problem I've been having.

To me, modern higher end solid state amplifiers tend have too much slam or too sharp transients and that ends up hurting my ears even at 60db levels. Even listening to mellow jazz, the piano notes are just uncomfortable to listen to because of the attack.

I currently have Buchardt S300 Mk II speakers, which are not high sensitivity by any stretch, and are rather smooth sounding, but I don't know if they could contribute to the issue somehow?

The worst case regarding amplifiers I tried was the Rogue Sphinx V2, which is 100W hybrid Class D with tube preamp. Another I had at home for an extended period and had an issue with was the Arcam SA20, which should be a relatively smooth sounding amplifier, and it did get a little closer to what I was looking for.

I currently have a Primaluna Dialogue Premium integrated and I'm very happy with it. The amp I tried to replace was a Marantz PM6005, which is also very smooth. Both are under the recommended power rating of the speakers (even though that's relative for a tube amp), so I'm wondering whether that could be part of it.

I listen mostly to vinyl (Graham Slee Reflex M preamp) with some digital too (Denafrips Pontus II). Both are relatively smooth and vinyl, while usually being softer, doesn't solve the issue. 

I'm looking to switch back to solid state (class AB) for various reasons and I was wondering if anybody had had similar experiences and recommendations for amps? Most amps, especially higher end, tend to emphasize the dynamics, punch, agility, etc. and I struggle to find anything that would seem to fit the bill. Tubes seem to do the trick for me, especially with some tube rolling, but not sure where to go with solid state. The budget would be around 2000$.

haskisoundi

Might want to consider a Naim Super Nait 3, or Ayon Sprit V.. I have a Aesthetix Mimas..None of these are bright or edgy I’ve owned them all. Look at power cords. Shunyata’s Venom line is amazing for the price. Consider a good Power conditioner like a Shunyata Hydra Delta D6. If the Naim is too much $$ look for a used Naim Super Nait 2... In fact with your budget I'd stick with buying pre owned.. $2K is a bit low for buying new.

I currently have my main system in the living room, which is also connected to TV and used for background music, so the hassle of warm up time, no stand by, etc. is leading to less listening. Also, I'm trying to avoid something that heats up as much and uses that much current.

^This *mirrors my thinking. I have PL amp, and while it is pretty good… I have the same thoughts, but the warm up time is not a deal breaker for me… but then again I do not wait an hour, I just fire it up and go.

We are moving house, so about 1/2 moved, and the new location is a lot cooler than the old one… but I get the heat part.

So I am at a bit of a crossroads whether to sell the PrimaLuna, and sell some mono block VTLs, and get a SS amp, or just stick with the PrimaLuna or VTLs.

In your case it seems like you have the PrimaLuna, the Marantz and the Puccini… which are all ones that produce good sound.

Hence either move them all on, and get something else… or keep one/all and stick with what is a known working commodity for you.

Given the budget, and the fact you have 3 amps that were/are fit for purpose… seems like it is a safe bet to just stick with what works.

THE OP's BUDGET IS $2000 !

Thanks, indeed, many of the suggestions are clearly above my budget. I did mention I was flexible until $3000 and perhaps this could get me something second hand, even though Switzerland is not the best country for that, it being outside the EU and having a small internal market. I can also go higher if I really see that's what I really need to find what I'm looking for, but that depends on how well I can sell some of the other equipment and also on making sacrifices elsewhere. However, it would be great to have options in the $2000 range.

One of my main frustrations, especially having limited possibilities to hear things for myself, is that reviews rarely talk about this aspect clearly. The Rogue Sphinx gets rave reviews from all the main outlets, but I don't remember having had a sense of it being so aggressive from reviews. Smoothness and lack of fatigue are things that don't come up in a coherent way, so I find it hard to identify which amps would work for me based on reviews.

^This *mirrors my thinking. I have PL amp, and while it is pretty good… I have the same thoughts, but the warm up time is not a deal breaker for me… but then again I do not wait an hour, I just fire it up and go.

Glad to know I'm not alone in this also and I hope you find the best solution for you. It is a dilemma and energy prices and long-term tube availability questions are not necessarily in favor of tubes unfortunately. I personally thought it wouldn't be as much of a hassle and to some extent this is more of an issue for my wife. I do only wait for the minute or so it takes until it's on, but that combined with it not having auto stand-by (the amp sometimes stays on the whole night or other long periods by accident) and not being able to turn it on from a remote all accumulates. Tubes are also a hassle, a driver tube just gave up and the amp thought it was the power tube, so it took me a while to know what was wrong. The feeling of never knowing when some tube is going to die adds to the burden somehow. I do miss something simpler, even though I love the sound of tubes.

Given the budget, and the fact you have 3 amps that were/are fit for purpose… seems like it is a safe bet to just stick with what works.

I agree, but that would be only the case for the PL. After being used to better, the Marantz PM6005 is too entry level for me and there's too much missing for me. I sold the Puccini. I though it was too colored and didn't really do it for me. I was really smooth for a SS though and a step up from the Marantz, even though maybe not enough.

Might want to consider a Naim Super Nait 3

There have been conflicting advise on Naim, but it has been mentioned a couple of times. Could the Super Nait specifically (2 included) be a possible solution? I've had some good experiences with Naim in other systems, but in very different settings, and I have sometimes found it bright and abrasive, but that could have been the speakers too (Focals in one case). It definitely got me emotionally a few times.

Thanks for the Shunyata recommendations, perhaps my Isotek cables are not helping.

I think that Class A is your solution

That's the feeling I've had for a while and I'm open to that despite the downsides. Budget is also an issue, as there are not many good class A options around $2000 (or even $3000). Separates are also not ideal for practical purposes (in addition to their price), except if the power amp has stand by and can be woken up by the pre (I have no idea whether this exists / is common). Apparently European versions have more eco modes and other such options for regulatory purposes. 

 

 

A quick summary of recommendations so far:

Class AB

  • Croft Integrated (tube hybrid)
  • Naim (Super Nait) (possibly not as smooth as other options)
  • Hegel H360 (possibly not as smooth as other options)
  • L-505UX II
  • Luxman L-509X
  • Accuphase E380-480

Class A

  • Used Hafler DH200/220
  • Used Krell
  • ModWright KWA (A/AB)
  • Odyssey Khartago Extreme
  • Luxman L-550AXII
  • Parasound Hint (A/AB)
  • Pass Labs (XA-25) - what about INT-25?
  • Accuphase

Cables / accessories

  • Shunyata (Venom) Power Cables and Conditioner

I didn’t take into account every recommendation, especially not the very high end options mentioned simply as current equipment. They should be more or less ordered according to price.

The most convincing tend to be, unsurprisingly, above my budget, so I’ll have to think about that.

Any comments on this list are welcome, especially as to how they compare, or if someone believes I shouldn’t consider some of these options. Any additions, especially in more reasonable budgets would be very useful, and hopefully not just for me.

If I had the budget, a Luxman or Accuphase would be my favorites at the moment, especially as they exist as relatively normal integrated amps. I would also prefer established brands in this price range. Or perhaps a Pass Labs integrated, but that stretches the budget much too far and they are to my knowledge hard to come by on the secondary market, especially in European versions, and I can’t try them out anywhere close by.

Regarding Luxman and Accuphase, would the class AB models be "smooth enough" or should I focus on class A as some have recommended, despite power consumption (and price, especially for Accuphase)?

I solved a similar problem with what I termed "glare" that, after trying a few combinations of gear, was firmly convinced was mostly a room problem.   Unfixable because of space, use and WAF.  In desperation I tried an equalizer.  Not recommended.  Then a month ago a last ditch demo and purchase of a used Luxman L-505uxii.  It really mitigated the problem and is a fantastic match with my speakers.  I had Herron pre and Pass XA-25 power (tube pre, class A power) and I do miss the smoothness in some backing vocals.  Overall a very smooth, engaging, dynamic, and powerful presentation though, with a surprising low noise floor.  I'm in love.  Like yourself, I wonder about going up/sideways in the line.  The 509x for the better pre or going with the class A offerings - rumored to be phased out by Luxman in the near future.  The 505 used was $3300, almost two years old.  Finding deals on Luxman is difficult to say the least.  I'm gladly keeping the 505 for now.  It's sooo engaging on 95% of my listening.