Speakers 10 years old or older that can compete with todays best,


I attend High End Audio Shows whenever I get a chance.  I also regularly visit several of my local High End Audio parlors, so I get to hear quite a few different speaker brands all the time.  And these speakers are also at various price points. Of course, the new speakers with their current technology sound totally incredible. However, I strongly feel that my beloved Revel Salon 2 speakers, which have been around for over ten years, still sound just as good or even better than the vast majority of the newer speakers that I get a chance to hear or audition in todays market.  And that goes for speakers at, or well above the Salon 2s price point. I feel that my Revel Salon 2 speakers (especially for the money) are so incredibly outstanding compared to the current speaker offerings of today, that I will probably never part with them. Are there others who feel that your beloved older speakers compare favorably with todays, newfangled, shinny-penny, obscenely expensive models?

kennymacc

@daveyf wrote:

@mikelavigne You are a highly experienced a’phile, why would someone believe that they could improve your system, without a) first listening to it and then b) believe that their knowledge would trump yours??...I don’t really understand this attitude from several members who have posted upstream. To these very same members, i would ask this question: Is it possible that in fact someone like Mike L could have a superior sounding system to yours...and not only that, have more experience/knowledge than you?

Speaking for myself and my replies to @mikelavigne I anticipated an above-like response, and it’s not without merit. Maybe I even hoped such a reply would be leveled at me/us so that I could better explain at least myself and not come across as an arrogant know-it-better, but rather that my intention was to challenge a single aspect of which I find myself to have some experience here that Mike, it appears, does not - at least not extensively with his 2-channel setup.

Yes, I would expect most everyone to find Mike’s system to be superior sounding to my own setup, and yes it wouldn’t surprise me if Mike - in a range a areas - has somewhat more knowledge and experience than I. Hopefully I made it clear that I can only assume it’s a truly great sounding system of his, and that the implementation in every regard, from all that I can assess, has been thoroughly considered and executed. The effort and time put into it all is certainly awe inspiring.

That being said it’s also problematic to blindly expect an individual with a highly sophisticated and expensive system like Mike’s is above criticism or suggestive acts of any kind. Having not listened to his setup implies both the fact that I can’t judge its sonic merits, just as well that I cannot take it for granted it’s a sound that - despite the money, time, research, effort and dedication that went into this - would blow me away in every single aspect. I’ve heard my share of über-expensive setups in homes that left me quite unimpressed; systems that sounded disjointed, uneven, stale, bloated, over-damped (more than under-damped, actually), overly detail focused, malnourished, etc. Very few of them sounded really natural to my ears, and it just goes to show that every setup, regardless of price, is a potential only, but also that personal preference varies. Preference I can deal with, but a badly implemented system is just a waste.

Nothing to me implies that Mike’s system is badly implemented, on the contrary. I merely suggested an approach, of which he apparently has no experience to speak of (and who among us has experience in every facet of audio reproduction approaches?), that could potentially lift the sonics to even higher levels of quality. From my chair it would be worth pursuing if this particular area (i.e.: outboard active configuration) is a stone unturned - not least with the ambition at play here.

All acoustic factors that contribute to a better sound are numerous they are all different but all are related acoustically ...The electronics of component and their design , the system /room acoustic , the psycho-acoustics specific ears filters of the owner and his specific audio journey and experience and experiments , and the specific working embeddings dimensions : mechanical,electrical and acoustical controls of the Ears/ room/system/house, by control here i spoke about electronical control but also often forgotten the mechanical controls , ALL aspects are important and differ in impact to begin with the specific synergy level between components as the first starting point ...

Remember now this : there is a minimal acoustic satisfaction threshold SPECIFIC different for each of us , or M.A.S.T. to be remember easily and there is also an optimal satisfying acoustic threshold or O.S.A.T. similar for all of us by the way  ...

 

The minimal and optimal tresholds differ by all the factors i described in the first paragraph above...Not only by price and evident design quality of the components ...But the two levels the minimal and optimal had something in common they represent in their price bracket/ sound quality ratio , a BALANCE between all acoustics and audio factors which are implied , one in a minimal way, the other in an optimal way ...

Mike Lavigne seems to me along the years here with all his posts very happy and satisfied by his audio system/room ...He is on the ultimate OPTIMAL level of possible satisfaction, which is almost evident for everyone because of the quality of design and the room quality and his expressed knowledge ... His system is among the costlier one here...

I am myself with a 700 bucks system/room , very happy and completely satisfied AS WELL AS HE IS ... I am on the MINIMAL level of possible satisfaction ...Which level when reached give to us music already with a good timbre, spatial aspects and immersiveness with my speakers as well as with my headphones...

People in general want to improve our system, Lavigne or mine , the costlier here and the less costlier , without knowing all the factors enumerated in my first paragraphs... They even dont know how to tune a room , as someone here said to me that room tuning dont even exist, then i will invite people to not criticise anyone system...

Think twice about what you know and what you dont know ...Perfection dont exist in musical and acoustic playback but trade-off , wise one and unwise one , wanted one and unwanted one ... Our ears/brain are not perfect they are efficient in their own specific way and history ...

Remember : everybody must learn how to hear and listen and it is not given by gear upgrades mainly ...

Psycho-acoustics science rule audio not the gear name or price...

By the way i know how to improve my system drastically but at a price which will be 15 times at least my actual price...I cannot and i dont need it because of the M.A.S. T. i enjoyed...

It is the same thing for Lavigne , it will be very hard to improve his system drastically and anyway he dont feel the necessity nor the urgency because he is on the O.S.A.T. side of audio...

My Linn Nexus from 1988 still sound great!

Nexus are Linns best selling speakers of all time. Matched with a Hsu sub,  they really shine at higher (+70 db) levels. Recently purchased  a backup used set for $150. My system consists of an LSA Warp 1 amplifier,  Audible Illusions Modulus 3a preamp, Wiim Pro Streamer, Gustard r26 Dac. And Chord Clearway interconnects. Love it!

@phusis One other thing i have also learned in this hobby is this: it is just as easy to go backwards in regards to SQ when you implement something into your system, as it is to go forwards...and many times, even easier!

Interestingly, the dealer I visited most recently utilizes a Linn turntable with the latest thinking by Linn on the interface between the table and the upstream phono stage. Their phono stage is now built into the table and called the Urika 2. This phono stage takes the analog signal and transforms it into the digital realm to send it upstream. Essentially, one listens to a digital signal when now playing the top flite LP12 Klimax model with Urika 2! On paper, this looks impressive, because not only is the signal taken immediately from the tonearm via a very short lead to the phono stage, but also the potential for loss of signal is now limited upstream, due to the digital conversion/aspect. Unfortunately, in real life, what I always hear when i hear this set up is the following...1) a severe lack of depth portrayal 2) a sheen that can only be considered as a digital artifact that pervades across the whole frequency spectrum and 3) a certain timbral aspect to the high frequencies that upon first listen is impressive, but actually wears on one as time progresses. My point here is that while Linn ( a well respected company within the a’phile community) believe that their way forward is superior to what has been done in the past, in my personal opinion, they have actually gone backwards. Is DSP the answer? Possibly in some systems, but I would say that an ’analog’ solution would be preferred firstly, if at all possible. At least to my ears, and IMHO.

 

So, to add to my last post...here is a question for the folks on this thread...

Is it possible that more experienced a'philes will have enough knowledge/experience of how to put together a system so that it has the least chance ( i'm not saying that all of these folks will not occasionally make mistakes and regress, but also not make obvious mistakes, like ignoring room acoustics, cabling, etc) of in fact going backwards as regards to SQ in their rooms/systems?