Advice needed: It's time for a new DAC


Hello People of Audiogon!

I received some help a little while back when I was considering upgrading my speakers so I am looking to the community again for guidance and opinions.  It is time to upgrade my DAC.  

 

My current system is Sasha DAW's driven by a Luxman L-509X.

 

The three DAC's on my short list are:

 

MSB Discrete
Berkeley Alpha V3
Chord DAVE

 

One thing to note is that I am in Canada so many brands are difficult if not impossible to audition.  

My priority is "musicality" or "soul".  What's this?  Well to me, it means feeling.  The Luxman and Sasha's well convey musical emotion and that is important to me.  I don't know how to describe it better beyond that.  They have flow (perhaps PRAT, to use another vague term).  Sounds have meat to them and texture.  The music feels real.  

 

The second priority is three dimensionality.  

 

The third is resolution.

 

My one caveat is no tube DAC's.  Tubes, for me, just don't work well based on my listening style and habits.  I love tubes, I've owned tubes and tubes are wonderful, but as things are now, I just don't want them in a DAC.  Perhaps they will find their way into my system in a pre-amp in the future.

 

I listen primarily to Tidal but MQA is not a priority for me.  I would switch to Qobuz but they were not available in Canada until recently and all my play lists in Roon are with Tidal tracks so I suspect a switch will be a real headache, but I digress. My point is MQA isn't really important and DSD isn't necessary either.  

 

Of the above DAC's, if you have heard them, what are your thoughts/opinion?  

 

Thank you in advance,

-Paul

 

 

bigfatpaulie

@bigfatpaulie In all honesty, the T+A DAC 200 should be in that list above considering all of the priorities you list (soul, holography, and resolution). I've said it before but I still think the DAC 200 is the best I've heard under $15K. In full transparency I am a T+A dealer, but I've had more than one customer switch from the DAVE to the DAC 200 because of its improved sound staging ability and soulfulness.

I’m really liking the Cen.Grand Deluxe DSD DAC, but hell... I LOVE my Tambaqui. I’d recommend the MMT, but the Cen D³ is excellent, and my biggest praises for it are in comparison with yet another DAC, two Intergarated amplifiers and a power amplifier

Of the three DAC’s you listed I would pick the Berkely V3, since I’ve heard less criticisms about it, but truthfully have heard less overall about it compared to the others.

My Cen D³ bests my T+A DAC200 in sound stage size, depth, and especially transient decay. I swear you can "hear" the air in the room whilst the artist was recording in between notes and at moments of silence. Just a very cool sound, almost to the effect that my Luxman M10x brought to my system when first listening (prior to the Cen D³). Secondly the Cen D³ made the sound presentation for my Technics SU-R1000 almost indistinguishable from my Riviera labs Levante. So the Cen D³ brings a "tube like" sound to a Class AB digital integrated amp that neared the liquidity in sound of an amazing hybrid amp. I was so impressed at how much character the SU-R1000 took on with the Cen D³ (good character at that).

Ultimately my MMT is my favorite, but the Cen D³ with the Levante just makes what I love about both pieces of gear stand out even more, not too mention the Cen D³’s volume control is better then the somewhat finicky Levante and allows me to run the JL subs via RCA out.

All and all I highly recommend the Cen D³.

My only digs are that the company’s reputation is unproven along with product service/support. I’ve ran into customs tearing apart my unit packaging and just throwing everything back into the box. I had a coaxial input issue with this unit and am otherwise am awaiting a second replacement unit. But still would recommend it. I’ve been swapping all my gear in and out with it and it sounds great with pretty much everything I own at all price points.

 

@blisshifi I could 100% see how a DAVE owner would love the DAC200, but I’m going to be listing mine now having the Cen D³. The T+A build quality and feature set is just incredible and in my heart of hearts wanted to keep the T+A because I really like how much time, attention and quality craftsmanship went into it, but I feel it’s DSD DAC far outshine it’s Burr Brown DAC chip, which kinda let me down.

It’s resolution and vocal forward presentation would again attract DAVE fans.

@bigfatpaulie that fuzzy center image is most likely due to first reflection points not being treated. The fireplace has some say in it but it’s negligible. The direction of the sound your Sashas put out is forward with tweeter and midrange dispersion to the sides at a slight angle. I don’t have a fireplace but had exactly the same issue. Cured by treating the first reflection points and installing bass traps to tighten up and refocus the lower registers. Snapped together nicely. 
May be talk your wife into hanging heavy curtains over that window by the right speaker. Mean time, toeing the speakers in to fire directly at your listening position should help with imaging as well.

As to the DACs, you have a nice list. If you use Tidal and don’t need DSD, go with the Berkeley Alpha 3 ( has MQA processing capabilities). However, keep in mind that it has no USB input and you will be using AES with it most likely, which means the clock in your streamer is what you’re going to be relying on. Not sure how good that section of the Lumin is. 
With the DAVE you can use USB (will most likely sound significantly better using that interface with your streamer) but you don’t get MQA. Chord tone is superb though. 
With MSB, you get awesome USB implementation, MQA and DSD capabilities. 
So if I were you, my choice would be the MSB Discrete. 
Just thinking out loud….

@bigfatpaulie 

@audphile1 makes a bunch of great points. I left out the Cen D³ doesn't have I²S in if that's something that you wanted, and converts all incoming signals to DSD up to 1024 (no MQA).

There might be an upgrade in the future and has a open module slot.