on the cheap

The Open Systems Interconnection (OSI) model breaks down data transmission standards, processes, and protocols into seven layers. Layer 1, the Physical Layer, is where the differences between Coax, Twisted Pair, Fiber and Wireless all lie. Ethernet is a Layer 2 protocol, as was IBMs Token Ring. TCP/IP, and once popular but now forgotten NetBEUI and Novell IPX, all are Layer 3 and 4 Protocols.

The beauty of all this is the ability to interchange technologies, Layer 1 media in this case, without having to redesign the entirety of the whole stack. Likewise, the shared bandwidth and scalability shortcomings of the CSMA/CD implementation of Ethernet at Layer 2 were addressed with the introduction of Ethernet Switching. The extensability of networks via routable protocols like the now ubiquitous TCP/IP and UDP enabled creation of the internet as we know it.

And our DACs? That all happens up at the top of the stack at Layer 7 - and above. 

So this isn't about one of us being right or wrong, or having an opinion, or changes in the language. This is about trying to get everyone on the same page when it comes to how digital audio actually works. There is no discussing if Ethernet works, it's settled science. There is no opinion as to whether TCP/IP assures bit perfect delivery - it is inherent in the protocol, initially designed so a network could survive a nuclear war. These things simply have to be or nothing would - or could - connect.

As our hobby becomes increasingly underlaid with digital infrastructure, it behooves everyone to take a few minutes to understand these basics so we can all focus on the music.

Wi-Fi is layer 2 as well. I don’t think there is a difference of opinion about whether Ethernet or Wi-Fi works, it was a question of whether Ethernet refers to a wired protocol vice a wireless one.  Ethernet is wired, Wi-Fi is wireless.  Wi-Fi uses a different protocol than Ethernet.  Sorry, I will shut up and and go enjoy some music.

what happened too my question?  I would like to find an inexpensive streamer that does not have to be physically hooked up to the router/modem. It needs to have a built in dac and hard drive with ripper and rca outputs. Not sure what is available.

Sorry about that I was part pulling this thread way off track.  Bluesound Vault would work as would the Innuos ZENmini Mk3.  Not sure what inexpensive is to you though as the Vault is $1400 and the Innuos is $2400-$3000 but you can find used for $2000.

'I am looking for suggestions for an inexpensive streamer for my sister. I mean a couple hundred bucks... AND also have a built in dac. The simpler the better. Would not have to be new. It would be nice also to have the ability to have cd storage.'

Your are giving us a kind of a challenge. Eagledriver likes this 😉

As jastralfu says above, second hand Bluesound Vault or Innuos ZENmini. Also, you might consider Cocktail Audio X30 or X35.

Or as kingr mentioned the Bluesound Node. If you can spare the CD ripper/storage.

Perhaps the Magnat MC400 or the Advance Paris My Connect 60? Both amps with CD player but no storage). In addition, the Fiio R7 (incl. USB 2.0 and 3.0 plus a memory card slot).

Using these products without an app? I'm not sure if this will work in a simple way.

To get exactly what you are looking for, you would need to be prepared to spend a bit more than a couple of hundred bucks. Even if the product is second hand.