VPI Prime Sig/Lyra Delos / Feedback ...help!

I was thinking about trading in arm for the Fatboy Gimbal , but if it’s this same plastic resonant material I’m nervous..🤔

@tommypenngotti I did exactly that move last year - started with 10.5i metal (Nordost) and 10" 3D wands on an Aries 3. Super cool table, but the 3D wand was just awful in my setup, because of this feedback. Unusable. Then I swapped to 10.5i, and everything was was lovely - big surprise, given all the feedback (haha) online about how much better the 3D arm is. I’ve heard a 3DR sound great - in my buddy’s system. He listens loud as me BUT he’s on concrete slab, and it’s no problem there. It even handled a Koetsu Rosewood Signature Platinum so well (with dual pivot), it impressed the hell out of me (I’m a Koetsu collector).

Of course upgrade urge hit fast and I bought a brand new 10" Fatboy Gimbal. It’s a great arm, I really do think Fatboys are the best sounding VPI arms. However, it’s not as quiet as the metal wands in this feedback problem, and it’s not as bad as the original 3D arms. It falls in between. The Fatboys have more rigidity which helps. I think with HW40 feet and Fatboy combined you’ll be fine. That was the case for me.

Of course THEN I snagged an Avenger Reference plus a couple 12" wands - lovely table but same arm feedback issues persist if you’re not careful. And unfortunately, I don’t think those fancy $2300 Reference feet are as effective as HW-40 feet at these feedback frequencies. So I’m really right on the edge of usability with a 12" Fatboy Unipivot (dual pivot). Even my SUT placement next to the table (I guess the lighter SUTs can pickup energy from the shelf and feedback in via cable) can make or break it. Meanwhile I have a JMW-12 metal wand that’s always silent and happy, no problem lol. MANY cartridge and phono stage combinations were tried here. It’s the wands. The Fatboy Uni is a GREAT sounding arm when I can get it right, though. I like it slightly better than the Gimbal. Gimbal vs. Uni vs. Dual doesn’t seem to impact the feedback much. I think materials and structure of wand is what matters here.

However, it does make me think since the 3D and Fatboy arms are a composite structure (reinforcing rods, etc), there COULD potentially be variance across units - some being quieter than others! Hopefully the Fatboys are more consistent because I really like them.

@mulveling 

man you are REALLY making an argument for just remove the Lyra Delos from the 3D arm & put it on my 10.5 JMW-10 metal arm (I was mistaken not a 10, it's a 10.5")

Also , my floor is all wood where table (also wood) is on , so Im sure that's not helping matters...

I listen very loud at times...

man you are REALLY making an argument for just remove the Lyra Delos from the 3D arm & put it on my 10.5 JMW-10 metal arm (I was mistaken not a 10, it's a 10.5")

@tommypenngotti  Yeah man! I'm 99% sure you'll be rockin' and loving it with the Delos in your 10.5 metal wand. Even better if you fit those HW-40 feet.

Also , my floor is all wood where table (also wood) is on , so Im sure that's not helping matters...

I listen very loud at times...

Yep I assumed these, because that's how it is for me too lol. I even have my rack well separated from speakers and down a side wall, but that energy travels the distance quite easily. 

VPI makes a 2nd pivot for their arms.....relatively cheap and is a very good upgrade....that will stabilize the arm.  Also, I would change the rear weight ...something heavier, then lighter to get the arm to respond differently to the cartridge. (Use clay or something and dial in the arm properly). I have a Superscoutmaster with rim drive classic platter speed controller et al.  The table was very slow and the speed controller made little difference....VPI wanted me to send back  almost 70 lbs or so table back to VPI after saying my speed controller was running perfectly.  I felt that friction was the culprit, and after cleaning the bearing et al with alchahol, it was still very slow. I'm a gun shooter and decided to use Hoppes #9 bore cleaning to clean it up.  It did a fabulous job, the table is silent and running true.  Try different things on your table and you'll hit the answer.

I haven't heard YOUR table / arm combo with a Delos.  But I have not had good experience with Lyra cartridges with the VPI 12" unipivot arm (VPI Aries Extended).  Have not heard ANY Lyra cartridge work well with a VPI unipivot arm on any table.  I switched to a Jelco TK-850L and both the Lyra carts I currently have just love it.  

I have heard VPI unipivot arms work VERY WELL with AudioTechnica MC carts.