Could Class D really be that good?


I've heard statements praising modern class D amplifiers all the time but was sort of hesitant to try. Lately, one particular model caught my eye, the Fosi V3, which costs sub $100 but is praised for having refined sound like class A/B. To fulfill my curiosity, I quickly ordered one and tried it with my Burchardt S400II and Wharfedale Linton speakers. Basically, this is a neutral sounding amp but, to my surprise, the sound is clean, open, airy, with full mids, wide soundstage, good imaging/separation, with nearly null traces of the edginess, dryness, or lean sound that traditional class D amplifiers have. The background is just as quiet as my current systems. The core is the TPA 3255 chip from TI and comes with a 32v, 5A power block, which is supposed to deliver approximately 65 watts per channel (into 8 ohms). It drives the S400II/Linton without any hesitation, as well as my 130-watt-per-channel high-current Parasound A23. Very impressive.

Measurement is not everything. However, according to the lab test results, when operated under 10-60 watts, the distortion level (THD) is below 0.003%, better than a lot of high-end (price) gears. I am going to build around it for my fourth system with upgraded op-amp and LPS. I believe it will outperform my current mid-end (price) amplifiers.

I know, I know, quite a few Audiogoners' systems are above $100k, and mentioning this kind of little giant that costs a fraction could be rather embarrassing. But I thought this is just like gold digging with a lot of surprises and fun. Don't you think?

lanx0003

You just stated above that any modern op amp has no sound (will not change the sound). 

@ricevs 

The above statement is false. Here is what I actually said:

Not to put too fine a point on it, but when you can change an opamp (if its modern, hi performance) and hear a change (other than noise floor), one of two things is happening: 1) confirmation bias, or 2) the circuit has a design flaw.

That isn't me saying 'any modern opamp has no sound'!

What I am saying is that if you know how to design with opamps, and if you compare high performance opamps, then you will not hear any difference other than perhaps the noise floor.

I know there are companies that make a living selling opamps based on them having a 'sound'. But any engineer finds that sort of thing to be a facepalm event. It means either the opamp is poor performance compared to what is readily available (and probably for a lot less money) or the circuit in which it is used is poorly designed, or both.

 

 

I knew you could not leave it alone.....you had to have the last statement....so, i will not comment and let the readers here decide for themselves who has truth and who is blowing smoke.

If you want to know something about anything.....then do some research. The internet is a vast wealth of knowledge......but one persons opinion means very little. Don’t be a sheep or a lemming.......After finding out what MANY others say then find out empirically *with your senses" what is true, for YOURSELF. Listen and know. Do not believe me or anyone. Do your own research.....be your own creator, your own God.....for we are made in the image of the almighty. We CAN KNOW for ourself, what is really true about anything......including what is our true spiritual identity/reality......In MY EXPERIENCE......we are all love. and incredibly beautiful and amazing. The truth shall set you free......free from your ego mind.....free from worry.....free from death.....for we are eternal. Happy forever!

@ricevs

The measurements don’t change but anyone can hear a difference? This is a huge discovery, and understanding what is going on will advance science. If you can figure out a way to show what it is we are hearing with some new measurement your name will go down in history. Heck, if you can even demonstrate that people are hearing a difference in well conducted tests, and nobody can measure a difference, that alone will get you in the history books. We’ll have a huge scientific mystery to look in to.

You’ve got to do it man, for the sake of scientific progress! If you get good data out there, even the most resistant, hardened skeptics will have to relent. In time, they'll thank you for it.

This is not a discovery. Those that have listened, have known this since audio reproduction and measureing equipment were invented. Most things that make a sonic difference cannot be measured.......plain and simple. Why would I care to convince some science measurement addicts that this is true. Its maybe 20% of people who think of themselves as audiophiles who believe that way. I say, let them have their playground. But when they come into our commonly heald public presence.....and speak their non-listening.....no real empirical knowledge BS.....then we need to speak our listened to truth and wish them a nice journey.

The ego is very stubborn......ever heard the term "dead right". A non believer will not even attend a listening session with believers (try inviting Ralph to your op amp rolling listening session).......If they heard a difference then they would have been wrong all this time and if they told everyone in the room they heard no difference....then those people would think they are deaf or stubborn and never trust what that person says from that point on. The ego wants to maintain the status quo.....if you say in public the sun is blue....then your ego will defend that position till you die or admit you were wrong......and who wants to admit they were wrong.

The whole problem here is false identification. We think we are our bodies, feelings, thoughts, sex, race, religion, etc. WE are NONE Of that. We are infinite spirit. We don’t need to cling to thoughts and "protect" ourselves from each other......WE are truly all one......one big blob of love. The mind cannot hold this infinity that we are....so we pretend we are less than the all that is and judge ourselves and everyone. When you realize that you are the MOTHER of all creation (creating every single thing you experience and that everyone experiences)......and also everything in the whole universe is ALSO the MOTHER of all creation......and that creation is happening every single second of the forever that we are......it changes you.....You treat everyone and everything as your BABY, your young chiild, your pet....your ultimate lover. Divine mother is everywhere. You are divine mother......Happy Mothers day.......it is always mothers day. Kisses and hugs.

@asctim I can't seem to convince that guy that what he's saying about me is wrong. 🙄

@ricevs This is not a discovery. Those that have listened, have known this since audio reproduction and measureing equipment were invented. Most things that make a sonic difference cannot be measured.......plain and simple.

This was true back sometime in the 1980s. But measurement tech like nearly all other technologies has improved quite a lot in the last 30-35 years :)

But many people don't realize that, and worse yet, wouldn't understand the import of the measurements if they saw them- and quite often, they are not published. So the myth (as purported above) continues.

These days there is a direct line between what we can hear and what we can measure. The tricky bit might be understanding what to measure...