Recommendations for MM Phono ~ Tube or Solid State

@lewm 

Thank you for your recommendation on DSA. I will read up on its potential in my system. No offense but I will never consider buying a one off product due to my past experience. I lost over $11K in one such product :-( 

Was it stolen, or did you lose $11K between buying it and later selling it? If the latter, as I am sure you realize, audio gear is not a good way to invest. Also, if you choose carefully and like what you buy, you will keep it for many years. Those many years of listening pleasure are compensation for any long term cost of ownership. In any case, you cannot lose $11K, if you pay $4K (what I paid for mine) or less (if you believe Pindac) for an Essential 3160, and a DSA phono III can also be had used for less than $11K, I would think.

Wait! I thought of a third possibility for how you could have lost $11K.  The unit malfunctioned and because it was "boutique" or a one-off, you could not get it serviced.  Is that it?  If so, neither the 3160 nor the phono III fall into that category.  Good service is available on both.

@lewm   :  Obviously I know the owner who offered the 3160 for 3K in USA. He is avery kind Asian Deargentleman who all his life was and is accustomed  to certain kind of color in MUSIC LP reproduction ( not the natural color that comes in live MUSIC. ) and with a way of thinking a little different from non Asian audiophiles.

Yes he had tube electronics but 17 year ago he was in " shock "/surprised by the Essential 3160 that's a " non-signature " quality level performance other than the natural color of what's in the LP recording. He was waiting for a deep transistor signature that could be to agressive to his like but was not that way and he had the unit for several years and yes it has today tubes. He never mentioned to me that could exist some kind of quality performance characteristics where he dislike and when I talk with him about he just told me that the new phono is what he needs.

Now, just from the begining with the Essential 3150 till today our alternative to handled MC cartridges gain stage needs to be through bipolar devices because it satisfied best the MC electrical needs as MM are better served by FETs, this not means that we can't use FETs in the MC stage because we can do it but our choice about it does not changes yet over time.

You are rigth when posted that soliid state active electronic devices ( other than OP-Amps. ) that over the last 20 years in true there were  really no high improvements especially with bipolars used in phono stages, FETs has some " news " in this regards.

The major changes in the solid state electronics designs came with the SMD passive parts  that permits lower noise levels and circuit boards " size " but the SMD has a limitation against the true hole passive parts and is its temperature limits where can works.

When designers/manufacturers as the ones top Phono Stages has a NEW model in reality ( this is our experiences with FM Acoustics, J.Curl Vendetta Research, Boulder and the like. ) is not a totally new design because the units designed before where really " statements " of product and in the " new " ones the foundation of the design came and comes from that first unit and only change the approach in the new unit design with some design improvements " here and there " that the customers can hear: the overall new unit has ( not and day differences. ) better quality level performance with out losted the main design characteristics from where it came/comes. The  Blowtorch  unit is an example of those: the whole design of that Phono Stage were made by 3 different and touted designers where the " job "  of J.Curl was the phono electronics design where he took as design foundation his Vendetta Research  he did not " invented " a totally new design.

Yes, as in the began the 3180 still is a PhonoLinePreamp ( 2 independent active phono stages and 1 line preamp. All fully balanced and true dual mono. ) because if in any part of a home system we need a very special kind of sinergy/harmony/in sync/in tune is just there between the Phono Stage design and the Line stage design along its active/passive parts.

There we don't want a MIX of different " colors " between Phono Stage and Line Stage because is not good in anyway ( in a good designs ) to the MUSIC and the MUSIC reproduction.

LP reproduced MUSIC must and has to sound as the MUSIC score that was recorded in the same VENUE to achieve the same kind of instruments Transients Response.

That and no matter what can't be  acomplished  with separate Phono Stage and Line Stage coming from different " manufacturers/designers. We need to take care of that cartridge signal extreme fragility to avoid at maximum its degradation. We care of system hardware where really matters.

Yes, for us both units most be integrated but this is only us and other gentlemans have their own way of thinking and MUSIC enjoyment.

R.

Btw, @lewm   : Do you think that the DAS parts and box can have a price of 19.K as is its price tag?  I know you don't and

Certainly not, maybe 5k and the other 14K-!5K where are?. Obviously inside the designer/manufacturer knowledge levels and skills and if you open  the FM Acoustics you can say: hey where are the 120K that I paid for both units ( phono and line )?  because not you but no-sense gentlemans could say no more than 10K down there but it's the Manuel Huber knowledge/skills who puts him There and between other unit/design characteristics " things " like these:

""" 

• Ultra linear balanced line drivers: no more matching problems of cables and electronics.
• Entire unit uses discrete circuitry of proprietary enhanced Class A design: no signal-degrading IC’s, transformers, hybrid circuits, tubes or op-amps.
• Hand-selected, high-precision matched components of DIN, IEC & MIL standard secure accuracy and long-term stability.
• Performance without equal. The technology, circuitry and manufacturing methods are proprietary to FM ACOUSTICS.
• The ultimate solution for restoration work, mastering studios, libraries and dedicated record collectors.  """"
•  

R.

@lewm stated "I see that there was one on US Audiomart for $3K and sold".

Nothing incorrect in that statement.

As for the follow up Posts looks like the referencing a Phono Model has flung the door open for plenty of very Biased Sales Spiel. Nothing new to be discovered on the 'Gon', this agenda lurking in the corners.