Preamps built Into DACs

"The reason remains somewhat unclear but to the ones I spoke with it was the challenge of the circuit. I somehow doubt that is why, I think it more an economical one and we need a frank discussion of that."

I can speak to why I did it in my DAC. It was strictly because there was an opportunity to leverage the D/A technology to create a superior volume control with lower noise, distortion and no compression. It's all about performance. My volume technology can only be done within a D/A converter and cannot be adapted for analog circuits. If it was inferior to other active analog volume technologies, I would not have done it.

I believe other manufacturers typically add inferior volume control circuits because their competition adds this feature, so they have to add this feature. Their marketing depts decide for them. This all got started by one DAC manufacturer IMO.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio

"Wonder why no one has build this"

Empirical Audio and Weiss both have it, at least variations.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio

All good tube active preamps probably do improve the behavior of the amps, particularly dynamics, because they have sufficient drive compared to resistive passive linestages or op-amp DAC outputs.

However, and this is a big however, removing them from the signal chain is even better.

What you must understand is that some DAC volume control technologies do not "replace" the active preamp, they actually eliminated it. There is actually no preamp circuitry in the signal path at all. It is exactly like connecting the line-out of a DAC directly to the amps.

When you do this, the distortion, noise and compression that is in every active preamp, even the most expensive, is eliminated. Sound quality is a LOT better IME, particularly when the drive of the DAC is sufficient, like the drive (current) of an active pre.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio

SteveN,
I``m not an engineer or electronics component builder and thus lack the background to debate at all on technical grounds.
All I have to offer is based on hearing and I trust my ears and my spontaneous reaction to what I hear or emotional response (does it involve me or not and to what degree)What ever steps it takes to get there I`ll do it.

So far in my listening experiences premium quality tube preamps are an asset and clearly improve the sound quality. I`m sure the actual builders/designers of top level preamps could explain why their products improve performance and articulate the reasons(technically) quite well(which I`m unqualified to do ).

There`re just going to be proponents of both sides,direct connection vs active preamps,it`s great to have choices in the marketplace.
Regards,

Charles1dad, you said it very well and my experience is the same. No active preamp in a system is wonderful sounding to some, but I have always found the resulting sound cleaner, lighter and lacking in body, weight, natural tone and impact. No active preamp systems seem to provide more detail and can certainly be quieter, but over time I became aware that the perceived transparency and detail was really a result of other important musical cues being missing.