Does HiRez really sound better?

"Are you saying that common audio measurements (such as frequency response, signal to noise ratios, dynamic range, etc.) mysteriously cannot be measured for vinyl but can be exactly measured on digital formats? This would be very troubling but convenient for anyone wishing to avoid objectively comparing the two formats. Fortunately,however, your statement is not factual."

No. I said resolution. With digital, you can label something 16/44 or 24/96 or whatever. You can't do that with analog. And even if you could, it would probably be too impractical to use in the real world. Analog resolution varies with equipment choice.

"The reason I referred to this article was to demonstrate the reporter's total lack of understanding of the importance of a recording's provenance. No, I don't think he was qualified to conduct such a test, precisely because he didn't realize he was asking his subjects to choose which recording sounded best when both recordings were identical. Because of this, the results of his test are meaningless."

If that's what you meant, then I obviously misread your comments and take back what I said.

"My main point is that the major labels are using standard resolution older masters of their recordings, transferring them into hi-res formats, increasing the prices and marketing these as hi-res without disclosing the provenance of these recordings. Doing this adds no improvements in sound quality but may garner large revenues from uninformed consumers. I'd prefer these potential buyers to be well informed. I'm fairly sure the major labels would prefer otherwise."

Maybe you could explain this because I'm not sure how you are coming up with it? When you say that they take standard resolution recordings and transfer them to high rez formats, what are we the resolutions in question? I'm not sure that I know what standard resolution is, in the context of your comment.

I see this as one of the challenges of wide spread acceptance of high rez although as john darko states is an extreme example this does further illustrate nobles point.

http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2015/02/disrespecting-artistry-becks-morning-phase-as-a-hi-res-download/

Zd542,

You stated:

"No. I said resolution. With digital, you can label something 16/44 or 24/96 or whatever. You can't do that with analog. And even if you could, it would probably be too impractical to use in the real world. Analog resolution varies with equipment choice."

I definitely agree that vinyl analog resolution varies with equipment choices; I've even read a comment from another vinyl enthusiast who claimed his very expensive vinyl setup possessed infinite resolution. I think that's a bit optimistic, given the very real limits of the technology. The only limiting factor with digital audio resolution occurs if an analog multi-track reel-to-reel tape recording is used as the master, rather than recording the performance directly to digital via PCM. This distinction, between transferred from an analog master and recorded direct to digital, is at the center of the provenance issue.

This is related to your other question:

"Maybe you could explain this because I'm not sure how you are coming up with it? When you say that they take standard resolution recordings and transfer them to high rez formats, what are we the resolutions in question? I'm not sure that I know what standard resolution is, in the context of your comment."

'Standard resolution' to me is any format that had a multi-track analog tape as its source; this would include most cds and LPs. I would also classify any hi-rez files, if they were transferred from an analog tape master, as 'standard resolution'.

I wonder if anyone has recorded direct to digital via 16 bit/44.1khz PCM for a cd, bypassing the analog master tape? If so, I would think this has the potential to sound very good, too.

Chrshanl37,

Thank you for posting that John Darko article, it was very interesting and relevant to this thread. I hadn't read it until now and can't disagree with his summarizing paragraph at the end:

"Whilst the hi-res file retailers(hopefully) resolve the issue of quality control and provenance reporting, let's stop foisting talk of twenty-four-blah-one-ninety-bleurgh onto Joe Public and his mates because, as we've recently seen with all the Pono bashing emanating from the mainstream press (with its implicit non-audiophile perspective), it will do more harm than good."

"The only limiting factor with digital audio resolution occurs if an analog multi-track reel-to-reel tape recording is used as the master, rather than recording the performance directly to digital via PCM. This distinction, between transferred from an analog master and recorded direct to digital, is at the center of the provenance issue."

That's not necessarily true. You're assuming that the digital recorder is of a higher resolution than the analog recorder. While its possible that may be the case, it could just as easily not be.

"I wonder if anyone has recorded direct to digital via 16 bit/44.1khz PCM for a cd, bypassing the analog master tape? If so, I would think this has the potential to sound very good, too."

I'm sure its been done by someone, but in most cases, music is recorded in a higher resolution digital format, and then downsampled to CD quality.

I don't know if you'll agree with me on any of this, but maybe just this 1 thing. It would be nice if the industry would get together and set some standards as to what it considered standard, high and low resolutions.

As a recording engineer I would strongly disagree that r to r tape is less resolving than hi rez digital. They both, when done right, can sound fantastic and in many cases r to r can sound even better.

Did you know that Walter Becker ' s Circus Money was recorded on r to r using dolby sr noise deduction. Yes it is a bit overly compressed but as for pop it wipes the floor of most all pop recorded today....hi rez digital or not.

You really need to listen to well recorded analog to appreciate what that medium can do.

Also, what about direct to disk? If that ain't hi rez....well......