2. analog
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Analog experiment

Hi everyone. Some of you will remember my post from a couple weeks back about trying out vinyl. My dealer setup that old AR for me and I listened to it for a while and then listened to the same records on a new Pro-Ject RM 6 SB with a Sumiko Blue Point #2 cartridge. I liked the Pro-Ject better so I took it home for an audition in my system.

I borrowed some basically new LPs from my dealer's collection. Most of them are the 180 gm. "audiophile grade" limited editions. I got U2 War, Eagles Hell Freezes Over, John Lee Hooker, Pink Floyd DSOTM and REM Document. I was familiar with all these and own the CD counterpart of each album for direct comparisons.

I carefully setup the turntable making sure it was level. My dealer has been selling turntables for decades so I trust the other adjustments. I used the C42 to level-match the outputs of my Sony C333ES SACD player and the Pro-Ject, again for fair direct comparisons.

I listened to each album on its own on the turntable and then I went back and played the Sony in parallel. I switched between the two sources from my listening chair. In this case, I would keep the turntable 40 seconds ahead of the Sony so every 40 seconds I could hear the exact same passage in digital form. Hearing memory is short so I kept the interval short. I also made longer comparisons to be sure of my thoughts.

The bottom line is that the Pro-Ject didn't sound any better than my Sony. They had exactly the same tonality and soundstaging. On DSOFTM in SACD, the Sony was virtually indistinguishable from the turntable. I couldn't believe it. This is the first time I can't hear a reliable difference between two different components.

With other records, the turntable seemed to have a slightly more extended and weightier bottom end. But then the Sony had slightly better definition so it was a wash. After these tests, I see no reason for me to go with vinyl. You think maybe the phono stage in my C42 isn't good enough? Or maybe the turntable should be a better one? Well then, I am even less interested in vinyl if that is the case. The Sony costs about $350 these days.

I am sure some of you will be upset with my decision but I have to say I was excited to try it out and I kept my outlook totally unbiased. I loved the looks of the Pro-Ject and my dealer has an awesome collection of vinyl for sale at really good prices so I wanted to tap into that. But I don't see any reason to do that now. Oh well!

Arthur
aball
flyingred
139 posts
 
Arthur, if the ProJect and your Sony are close on 40 second comparisons I would say that the table is fairly well set up.

I would also go along with an earlier post suggesting you just relax and listen to music on the table. I too find I can't listen very long to cd whereas I can (and do) play LPs all night. It's over extended listening that you appreciate the absence of digital artifacts.

Having said that, my advice to someone without an existing vinyl collection is to stick with digital and if you need a new toy, buy a Squeezebox and rip your cds to your computer's hard drive.

Most of the music I enjoy most was released in the 70s and 80s (and earlier in the case of classical) and the cd re-issues were never mastered as carefully, so they are genuinely inferior to the original LPs.
musicslug
430 posts
 
I think one experiment you haven't done and hasn't been mentioned could be potentially useful: try to locate 5 or so of your favorite pieces of music, regardless of format. then try to find them on the other format. do your listening in a less analytical way, simply playing the music as you normally would. if there's a meaningful difference (to your ears) it really should jump right out at you. the point of the experiment is that since you are theoretically very familiar with the music, you are more likely to hear the differences between formats (if there are any).

it seems to me that all of the talk about the quality of the pressings and masterings etc., while relevant, ultimately are a distraction from what you're trying to determine; those issues are present with both digital and LPs and you're trying to figure out something which transcends that question.
moemoney's avatar
moemoney
158 posts
 
Do not try to analyze what is happening - just listen and enjoy. The difference, if there is one, will really jump out at you when you switch back.
Zargon

So True, so true.
shadorne's avatar
Ag insider logo xs@2x
shadorne
7,477 posts
 
Anyone prefer gold and bartering with real commodities to the convenience of cash and credit cards...?

One is real and the other is a mathematical representation ...kinda like the difference between Analog and Digital. (LOL, perhaps I need to play my Matrix DVD again, I haven't watched it for a while!)
artizen65's avatar
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artizen65
273 posts
 
Arthur,

I like your testing methadology.

I have heard that the Sumiko Blue Point cartridges have a CD sound. Don't know if I agree but with my setup my vinyl and CD are very close. I enjoy both formats.

Vinyl Project RM4 with a Sumiko Blue Point cart into the onboard phono pre of a Musical Fidelity A308 integrated using Synergistic Research Kaladiscope Phase I active cables.

I put my modest vinyl rig up aginst a Theta Digital Data Basic II Transport connected to a Musical Fidelity Tri-Vista 21 DAC with a Synergistic Reaearch Digital Corridor Phase II Active cable. Using a SR Kaladiscope Phase I active to the MF A308 integrated.

I have about 150 albums that I collected in the later 70's and early to mid 80's. These are the only reason I even decided to go with a vinyl setup.

IMHO if you have no need to go with vinyl as in the fact that all of the music you want to listen to is on CD then stick with CD and don't put your self through the trials and tribulations that a vinyl setup brings.
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