In the latest The Absolute Sound

Albert,

I agree with Tim.

- my PRC3's arm is powered; so is the arm on every other Loricraft model currently on offer

- the arm is driven independently of the record groove; it traverses an ungrooved and/or non-spinning record just like a grooved and spinning one; it will even traverse and clean the bare platter, which I do from time to time to keep the mat clean

- best practice, as explained in the instructions, is to start the arm at the label and have it sweep outwards; you can use it the other way if you like variety ;-)

- I've never experienced liquid left behind in the runout groove, the lead-in groove or anywhere else

- twisting the thread spool by hand 1/4" after each sweep is a "chore" I can manage, especially if the alternative is paying $4,000 for someone to twist it for me!

I can certainly imagine improvements to the PRC-3, and Loricraft's newer models incorporate some of them, but what you've described so far may not address them.

- fluid dispensers only allow for one or two fluids; I use more than that

- a vacuum gauge would be useful if there's an adjustment, otherwise it serves no purpose

- string drive is a nicety that's not worth spending any money for (IMO of course)

- forward and reverse platter rotation with a slow speed for liquid distribution and brushing would be VERY useful; does the Odyssey offer that?

Best,
Doug

Elinor,

Your quote:

"I don't understand your comparisons. The SME 20 or 30 and the VPI HRX versus the Walker Proscenium Gold? You must not have heard these tables nor understand their technologies. The Walker stands alone and many times better than the rest of this crowd. I cannot speak about the Transrotor."

I am not sure who you are replying to, however, I do have plenty of knowledge of these turntables, despite being in Europe. The last sentence in your reply speaks for itself. When I referred to the Walker, SME's and VPI HRX, obviously I was comparing the character of sound to that of the Transrotor Apollon in which case it seems no one in the USA has had the opportunity to listen to one, therefore, a lack of any comparatives and snap judgment decisions cannot be made, only theories and assumptions until otherwise tested.

The turntables mentioned speak for themselves, however, the fact is their are some other turntables in this world of equal character to that elite crowd, just no one has had a chance to hear them. As soon as someone makes a qualified comparison or a review, we will be left pondering and in the dark. I will post my own rudimentary comments about the Apollon in the not to distance future.

V/r
Audioques4life

Jtimothya

Albert - I don't believe there is a non-motor-powered arm version of the Loricraft. Perhaps the pictures on your linked pdf for the Loricraft are "deceiving" as they show the pickup arm not attached to a motor. Actually, the bottom of the pickup arm shaft contains a magnet that couples to another magnet on the arm motor. The coupling occurs with the arm in place, so the pictures don't hint at this

That makes sense, it's impossible to know from the photo's. Good information I needed before I write a review on the RCM.

Doug

- best practice, as explained in the instructions, is to start the arm at the label and have it sweep outwards; you can use it the other way if you like variety ;-)

- I've never experienced liquid left behind in the run out groove, the lead-in groove or anywhere else

It appears the operation of the arm is identical for Keith Monks, RCM and the Loricraft, so the run out groove would not present any obstacle to cleaning where the grooves stubbornly direct the cleaning arm toward the center hole.

This WAS an issue with the LP being cleaned in England when I was covering the show there and photographing the Loricraft. Perhaps the demo was being done sloppily or perhaps that ONE LP had been cleaned tens of dozens of times for illustration and wound up being damaged or holding residual fluid.

Anyway, the issue is settled thanks to everyone adding to the pile of information.

As for Downunder finding the RCM at Ebay, I saw that too. In fact, if I had not included the term "Odyssey" in my text here at Audiogon to enable the search, the results are all but impossible to find.

Converting that Ebay price to US dollars is about $3600.00 and that unit is 240 volt. I'm not certain, but that fellow may be the manufacturer. I don't know what it would cost to ship from Europe and then convert it to 120 V, but it would not surprise me if it amounted to several hundred dollars. Add to this new total the import duty, profit for the importer and dealer margin for the end retailer (usually 40 or 50%) and the numbers are about right.

So, is the vacuum gauge, build quality, thread motor, possible vac adjustment or other features worth this additional money? That will be determined over the long haul.

The Loricraft has no dealer network and therefore costs less. I don't sell either machine, nor do I have plans to.

Last, is the Odyssey RCM better than the Loricraft? I can't imagine why, but according to Lloyd Walker (who owns two Loricraft machines) it is and that's the main reason I bought it. I moved from the excellent VPI 17F and wanted to make one last purchase of a LP cleaning machine, a machine that would last me the rest of my life. I think I made the right decision as I'm certain those that own a VPI or Loricraft are comfortable with their choices.

Albert, you are right. Just some Info about in general: The Keith Monks is "THE" Record cleaning Machine (RCM), it is all over the world known as the best there is. Very, very difficult to get a 2.hand one. Lots of collectors, studios, Radio Stations all over the world use it. It is very, very expensive, in Germany it was sold directly to have the chance to sell it to discriminated Vinyl Lovers.
The "Cult" about this unit made some think about copies, the Loricraft is based on that.
The Monks has the reputation to be the last one and it is true, they work all perfect.
That's the reason, why there are so rare on 2.hand, no one sells it, except he stopps listening to analog.
It is like a watch, when you want to have the "real" deal, go for a Rolex Daytona, when you only want to know the time, there are other choices.
The one from Albert is in a way the last step. Based on the last Monks version - my unit - with premium parts.

Thomasheisig, I'm out of my element here, though I have enjoyed talking with Terry Sullivan and seeing his cleaner at CES in year's past. The Monks product may be a much better vinyl cleaner than the Loricraft, but what is the difference in srp, and does the difference in cost correlate to the difference in performance?

Also, while some folks might think that the Rolie Daytona is the "real deal," I can assure you that many, many more collectors prefer other marques - particularly when it comes to chronographs. These absolute statements should be avoided...