Denon DL 103 vs DL 103R

Could you clarify "recognizing that I might need a phono stage with these"

What cartridge are you currently using? Does your Rotel have a built in phono stage? If not, what phono stage are you using with your Thorens/Grace set up? Do you mean a step up device? You may need one for the Denons but not for the Grado or Sumiko.

Sorry, I was saying that I may need, or want to use an additional external stage/step-up in addition to the cartridge itself. It might not be a bad idea regardless of the phono stage in my preamp. My pre does have a phono stage, which is what I'm using now, but its MM only with very low gain and I suspect I might get better results with an external unit. My current cartridge is a Sure M97XE.

I think your Rotel RC-1070 preamp might not be enough to squeeze the most out of 103 or even 103R. You might be better of using Dynavector 10x5($400) or 20X($650) or if you want to use >Ds< a step-up is a must (about $350).
Denon 103 or(R) has a large group of folowers and I am one of them. There is a lot to learn and gain in the right set-up. Read some more threads - it is almost all there. What is not there is yours to learn. I am myself half-way there
but you learn something new every day. It is a never ending story.....but how exciting it is ?!?!

Regards

I did not hear Denons but for me Grado Sonata and Grace 707 is a no go. I had it on Thorens TD124 and it sounded like $50 NOT $500 cart . It didn't work with REga RB1000 neither (nor with Denon Da-401). Some people though liked DL-103 with Grace. Shouldn't work theoretically but according to some posts it did. Music Maker carts ( based on Grado)have a good opinion among Grace owners there is only a question of putting $1K cart on $100 arm.Regards, L

I have had a Statement Sonata (.5mv), and have a couple 103 and an R, all good choices. But i'll tell you what i will recommend is the Dynavector P75 phono stage, especially the "phono enhance" circuit. All 3 sound great thru it. I've never heard a Grado sound so open, and the Denon sisters love it too! I like the 103 the best, but all have their merits. If your mm phono stage is good, transformers are a good choice also. There are lots of folks who prefer going thru trannies.
If the Sonata is in your price range, you should also check out the sound-smithdot modified Denons
I think you're on the right track. You didn't mention the TT or arm, that could be a deciding factor also.
Alan