best "entry level" audiophile TT?

Hi Flyingred. I too have a peeve with speed stability, but my issue is with DC motors. I have yet to hear a DC motored TT that has speed stability. I have listened to tracks were I could tell the TT was drifting, but the salesman/owner were blissfully unaware.

Psychic, I come from a modest background, but in spite of that I do not see the need to exaggerate. I also do not have the phobia that "the man" is out to rip me off.

Regards
Paul

Ok,

Interesting reading. Guess I will just have to put in my 2 cents for what ever it is worth.

1: The Project RM-5 is belt driven per the owners manual.

I own a Project RM-4 very easy to setup with the right tools. I use a Sumiko Blue Point Cartridge. This combination is shall we say IMHO very good for the cost. $499.00 for the table and $250.00 for the cartridge.

Although I have listened to other tables thay have not been in my system therefore I can only compair to my digital front end. A friend of mine says I would have to spend considerably more on my vinyl front end to better my digital front end.

At this stage I would consider it a tossup between the two. Now this is a $750.00 vinyl set up aginst a $5000.00 digital setup (Theta Data Basic II transport, SR digital coridor phase II active digital IC, MF Tri-Vista tube dac). I run SR Kalidiscope phase I active between the digital front end and the vinyl front end.

I am very pleased with the tone and sonics that I get from either front end. The seperation in the sound stage is execelent with both.

The setup of the table and cart is critical. In moving my table my VTF got knocked out of whack. I had to go to the dealer and borrow a VTF gague to get it right again. The result of to light of a tracking force in my case was week bass and an overly bright tone. Once the VTF was re-adjusted to a heavier tracking force within the recomended cartridge range the tone is much better and smoother.

The last piece of the puzzle is the phono pre. I use the internal phone pre in my integrated.

Could I achieve better sonics and tone with a dedicated pre probably but not without the cost factor of the pre and cables.

04-20-07: Artizen65
...The last piece of the puzzle is the phono pre. I use the internal phone pre in my integrated.

Could I achieve better sonics and tone with a dedicated pre probably but not without the cost factor of the pre and cables.

It depends on how good the phono section is in your integrated amp. Some integrateds (e.g., Creek) have good built-in or plug-in phono sections.

Given the cost and quality of your digital front end, I'd be surprised if you had an inexpensive integrated.

However, if you think you'd be better off with an outboard phono section, I'd recommend a Creek OBH-18 or Bellari VP 129, either of which go for about $250. I haven't heard the Bellari but it's a Stereophile Class B component, where most of the others in that group cost $900 to $1500. I have heard various Creek phono units and always liked them. To keep costs down on the extra interconnects while getting good signal transfer, I recommend the Audioquest Blue Racer or Black Mamba interconnects available at Audio Advisor. I have two pairs of Black Mambas and a pair of Blue Racers. The great thing about either of these is that they're made of single-crystal OCC copper, and the difference with the Black Mambas is that they're also 99.9999% pure copper. The Racers are $65 and the Mambas are $85 for a 1 meter pair. That's cheap for that level of copper quality, especially from AQ.

Dear Flyingred: +++++ " I hadn't realized it would be so tough - in my experience rubber belt tables don't do good (enough for me) speed stability and leading edge transients as well as .... " +++++

Well, " speed stability " ( IMHO ) every other thibgs the same makes a huge difference and yes many BD TTs are not up to the task but there are some that are: Walker, Raven, Brinkman Simon Yorke, etc, etc, unfortunatelly some of these have very high prices.
Now, as important ( critical I say ) as is the speed stability there are other important subjects that count on the overall performance: platter material, suspension, arm board material, kind of belt used, etc, etc.

+++++ " Once you've lost some fidelity at the source you can never get it back. " +++++

This statement is of paramount importance ( specially at the analog reproduction system ) and when we really understand it we could take care in deep about in any single link of the analog chain: TT/cartridge/cartridge set-up/tonearm/cables,Phonolinepreamp, etc.

+++++ " IMO, too many people upgrade too frequently to "improve" their system when a little work with the variables would deliver the same effect " +++++
This statement it is directly related with the last one: we have to try hard on what we have trying to setting up everything on target.

+++++ " I would also challenge your assertion about cartridges - if you work on VTA/VTF/azimuty and impedance/capacitance matching then the difference between carts becomes quite subtle. " +++++

It is only on this statement that I can't agree with you because if you have a good resolution system then the differences that you could hear will not " subtle " at least was not on my experiences about. All cartridges have its own " signature sound " that is different ( not subtle ) from one to each other ( inclusive in the same manufacturer line ), maybe I never try too hard about to had what you are experienced. So I'm with Rotarius opinion on this subject.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.