Project Debut III vs. Music Hall MMF 5?

05-22-07: Mechans
Agree that Direct drive is not noisy In fact the real differences I can hear are vanishingly small between very high end TT's and normal people TTs are the isolation from the enviroment. That means a higher mass dampening plinth and solid support and the cartridge choice. ... It is safer to pick a simple SS stage. YMMV. ... I might recommend a good vintage table direct drive and all or a more recent Denon DD with the DL 103.

Sounds like going low output moving coil raises the stakes significantly, making vibration isolation, noise from all sources, and hum-free gain critical. So at the price Bruno's talking about, it's simpler with a higher rate of success to go with high output mc or mm with a good phono stage for that level of gain.

The Denon 500 DD or a Technics SL 12x0 is a great place to start, as they all have very solid and rigid plinths, slick ergonomics, rugged build quality, and close tolerances. A detachable headshell is nice to have too, especially for beginners.

The Technics definitely benefits from some sort of isolation platform, but this can be done very cheaply with an Ikea butcher block cutting board ($25) and some Vibrapods or Mapleshade Iso-Blocks ($24/set of 4 for either).

For a well-regarded SS phono stage, you could go with a Creek OBH-18 ($250), Parasound V-Phono ($150), NAD ($129), Cambridge Audio 640P ($189), or Graham Slee Gram Amp 2 SE ($399). Of these the NAD and Cambridge do LOMC. The next model up Creek (OBH-15) also does MC at $450.

You'd need an MC pre-amp for the Denon 103. OTOH, you could get one of the good MM stages and use a Denon DL110 or DL160. Teaming one of those Denons with the Slee should create an interesting soundstage.

you are not comparing apples to apples you need to look at the pro-jec expression which is 499 vs the music hall 5. both come preloaded with a cartridge. if you do either go with the speed box for $99 also, and the tube box 2 for $349. if you have extra funds you can upgrade the the tube box se but i noticed a huge improvement with the speed box and you can swith speed with the push of a button not to mention better sounding music with better controll.

I got back into vinyl last year with the Pro-ject Debut III. The cartridge was pre-installed and the set up was easy. The only thing I did not like was the mat, it’s a cheap felt material. It made me really miss my old Pioneer PL 15 semi-auto table, I had in the early 70’s. So I got a Technics SL-10 Linear Tracking Turntable on eBay. The darn thing is just too easy to use. Just put in the record and close the lid, then push play. I still have the Debut III but don't use it. I'll sell it one of these days.

I tried several older "vintage" Linear tracking arm tablesmMy friend said they were the best tables around. Forget tis high end lunacy!
There is one major difference though he mods them.Just a cap here- and a resistor there- nothing huge but the sound is much better, especially in view of your cartridge choices.
My initial experiences with them was similiar to yours but they all had mechanical difficultuies. Some only lasted just a couple months but man its nice not buying a motor controller. The strobes and adjustments right there. No worry about the table running over auto lift and return.... Too bad it's like suggesting tone controls on your preamp. Instead you end up spending a fortune on different components cables etc.. I used NOS tubes also a major investment just to change the tone. The supply olf good old tubes is seems pretty much finally exhausted at this point. Finding a true New never used tube is exceedingly rare. What passes for NOS today is used but is still fairly strong and functions OK for the most part

Hello All,

So from what I am hearing, I may be able to get more bang for my buck in terms of construction quality and performance out of a direct drive table like the Technics 1200 series. This table does not come with a cartridge. As a vinyl beginner, it sounds like I should start out with a high output cartridge (either moving coil or moving magnet). Any suggestions on a cartridge that would pair nicely with the Technics 1200? I’ve never installed a cartridge before. From what I’ve read it sounds like a finicky procedure…

Does the type of music one listens to have an impact on what turntable he should buy? I listen all types, but mostly classical - if that makes a difference.

If I decide to go with a belt driven table it sounds like I should give serious thought to the Rega P-2 over the Music Hall. It seems like the general consensus is that the Music Hall MMF 5 is a superior table to the project III. I have been warned away from the Project Expression – the shop I visited once carried it, but upon hearing it, stopped selling it.
So, if the Project III is out of the running, should I go with the Rega P-2 or the Music Hall. Living in rural Vermont, I unfortunately don’t see myself having the opportunity to hear these tables side by side, so let me know what you think.

I’ve got some good recommendations for phono pre-amps. From what I’m hearing, tube pre-amps can sometimes be noisy (especially with low output mc cartridges). All the same, I am inclined towards the Tube Box because it was so fervently recommended to me at the hi-fi shop. With a high-output cartridge, will the Tube Box II (or SE) work as well as any?

Thanks for your help!

-Bruno