arguments against starting a vinyl collection?


Hi,

I have a pretty elaborate setup for cd playback. I use the emmlabs cdsd transport and emmlabs dcc2se dac with the dartzeel amplifier and the wonderful evolution acoustic mm2 speakers with powered woofers.

I own roughly 2600 cds and about 175 sacds.

The vinyl crowd still swears of course that great digital playback cannot equal vinyl so have been somewhat tempted to dip my toes into analog and get a turntable and phono preamp. Here is what is holding me back!

Please note that I would not get vinyl to find obscure vinyl only vintage or otherwise recordings.

It would be mostly targeted at recordings that sound better on vinyl than cd.

Here is the arguments against:

1. hard to find a turntable and phono preamp that is class A and thus as good as my emmlabs cd equipment without spending serious bucks?

2. Even if I could find a reasonably priced class A turntable, the best sound requires more skill than a newbie like I would have? In other words, the better turntables are harder to setup and use?

3. A lot of heavy weight albums are double albums so you need to switch sides three times?

4. You need to clean the vinyl before every listen?

5. If you listen 15 times to a particular vinyl album you will likely begin to hear some deteoriation?

6. Even with a good setup, you will probably still hear pops and hiss on many vinyl albums even some well mastered ones?

7. I will not hear for modern recordings a big difference between vinyl and cds given that my emmlabs equipment is so good and I cannot afford a $10,000 phono preamp and a $25,000 turntable/cartridge....

thanks

Michael
128x128karmapolice
Karmapolice,

IMHO, don't bother with Radiohead, Porcupine Tree and other such bands on vinyl. With all of the processing and digitization these bands use there is no point in recording it to vinyl. This is exactly why I keep both analog and digital sources.

But then, I'm coming at this from what appears to be the opposite side. For example, if it were me, I'd be starting a thread asking why I should spend more than a few grand on a digital source.
Dan_ed - I am going to be curious to see if your view on bands like Radiohead aren't worth pursuing on vinyl. Many people have commented how much better the recording is on the vinyl release than the CD. The Drive-by-Truckers just released five of their albums on vinyl and the band themselves talk about how much better it sounds on vinyl. You may well be right, and I currently can't evaluate for myself, but if that is a true statement, I'm going to be bummed.
I am currently right in the middle of rediscovering the joys of vinyl again after spending 20 years with digital. At this point, very early in the vinyl game, I feel as if I wasted 20 years and tons of money on digital.
Recently, I finally purchased a 'decent' phono preamp, my ears and brain have been filled with amazement as to how much more organic, live and real sounding vinyl is. Now we are comparing an $8,000 digital rig to a $3700 vinyl setup. I won't say every parameter of performance is improved, but the musicality of the vinyl vs. the analytical nature of my digital setup makes the choice a no brainer, I will take the musicality any day!
Small ticks and pops don't bother me (but then my early days were all vinyl so maybe I'm used to it), all the other chores to do with vinyl I've found to be rather enjoyable, more investment in the care of music get you more involved in that music (strange psychological phenomenon here).
Anyway, I'm through with digital in the short run, in the long run I will keep the digital setup I have or perhaps even upgrade, I have way too many obscure cds that will likely never come out on vinyl. I also have over 5,000 cds which will certainly keep me in cd. Having said that, I'm now in the process of culling and selling off cds to fund my vinyl collection.
I am also now in the process of planning about $3200 worth of upgrades to the vinyl rig, this was money formerly earmarked for a digital upgrade.
Perhaps the most difficult part of this 'conversion' has been the realization that 5,000 cds are now worth that much less to me, and I need to replace much of that music with vinyl, big bucks and major searching for replacements.
Large investments of time and money bring psychological commitment to digital and/or analog rigs we've put together, I know this commitment is what kept me away from analog for so long, its hard to tell yourself the path you've been on for so long is perhaps not the correct one for yourself.
This is not to say analog and digital can't live together, my long term goal is to maximize the strengths of both, enjoying both for what they are. Don't look at going into vinyl as a defeat for digital, rather see it as a win/win situation, most everything in life is not a zero sum game, enjoy both!
Karmapolice,
I think Sns' last post accurately describes what a lot of people go through when they decide to try vinyl again. I can see a lot of what I went/am going through in there. I agree with his last paragraph.

The thing which people do not mention is that vinyl takes more "work". CDs are great in that one can buy a CD online, receive it a few days later, dig it out, stick it in the tray, and play. And one can pause if interrupted, easily go back to the beginning of a track and do it all by remote.

With vinyl, I find it a lot more of a DIY process. One reason I buy/play vinyl is to get in touch with all those records I can buy for half the price of the CD (or a lot less), and that takes digging around to find the records. Then one cleans them (once, well, replacing the sleeve, and you are good for lots of plays), and when playing them, the vinyl is a bit more awkward to deal with (sleeve and jacket), clamp/weight on, perhaps a light brushing, and then (assuming all the settings don't change per album or you switch to a mono cart), physically moving tonearm over and cueing down, then getting up at the end of the side, moving tonearm back, removing clamp, flipping side, maybe another brushing, then clamp back on, cueing it back up, and lowering tonearm back down.

Dealing with records is a lot more 'physical', but I bet there are any number of us who don't do things which require just a little bit if manual dexterity enough for our own good (not to mention not enough exercise). I personally find the pleasures I get from listening to interesting records I pick up to be worth the reward. Also, there are so many records out there where I remember the music well, want to hear it again, so spend a dollar on the record and a few minutes cleaning it when I get home, but I would not spend $15-20 and time online trying to find someone who had the CD.

Last but not least, if you decide to get into vinyl, and you buy used off Audiogon, and in 6 months you decide the "hassle" isn't for you, you can sell it all back and you will not be out much more than your time. If you do, I might start with a used cart of good enough quality to match the rest of your set-up. If eventually you find vinyl to your liking, then I might upgrade to the "right" or "better" cart later. You can get quite a lot of a lot of lower-priced cartridges, but in the same way that the step up from a Sony SCD-1 to an EMM set-up was surprising, the step-up in quality from a 'decent' cart to a 'great' cart is similarly revelatory.
Even though I have about 100 lps and have decided not to take the plunge into vinyl I can certainly appreciate the beauty and romance of it as well as the labor.

Some of the systems posted on this thread are absolutely beautiful and I applaud all of you who have found your sonic nirvana.