How many People own Working Reel to Reel Decks?

Hi Mike,

I think you misunderstood me. I didn't mean the source as being the master tape. I meant the source as being my vinyl front end, or any other source I am recording. Not only me, but just about all the fellow tapeheads I associate with, cannot tell the difference from tape and source when listening. All of our tape decks have been fully spec'd or better. I use a guy that was Tandberg USA Factory Service Tech. in NYC, and he does many Open Reel machines for very wealthy people like doctors and lawyers, all very wealthy audiophiles. Maybe with measuring equipment you could tell a difference, but with our own hearing, we cannot, our decks are just that good. Maybe your hearing is better than all of ours, thats very possible, but I can speak for many of us, all with same results. None of us are using decks that we just bought in working condition, all have been completely gone through with a fine tooth comb, to the best that they can perform, and biased to todays higher biased tapes. Thats what im referring to when I made my statement. Ray

Ray,

trust me; i know that tapes made off tt's can sound very very good. i'm not being critical of them. but 'very, very good' is different than 'as good as the source' when that source is a top level tt.

as tt performance improves; making a tape that can equal it becomes more and more difficult. the refinement of cartridges and phono stage output circuts have become very very good. 70's solid state output circuts in RTR decks are crude in comparison.

the signal path is full of IC's and other 'crud' like any other 70's solid state hifi gear. when you tape the Lp the RTR input circut has an effect and then when it's replayed the output circut has an effect. you take the Lp output from a current high quality phono stage and then run it in and out of those circuts. then if you trade tapes the recording process again goes in and out of those circuts. every generation of tape has multiples of the loss of resolution and the noise floor increases.

which is why a tape of an Lp on a 70's prosumer deck can not equal the Lp. it's just phyiscs.

now; if you make the first copy on a 1" master recorder like The Tape Project does, then copy it on a set of custom configured Ampex master recorders there will still be a difference you can hear, but it will be very slight. but this set-up will be very expensive and require some real experts to make sure everything is just right. why would The Tape Project go to so much trouble to make the best possible dubs if it was easy. it's just not that easy.

no; i don't hear any better than the next guy.

it's only with digital that you can make perfect copies; but only because the life has already been sucked from the music during the A to D process......so who cares then?

i think that if someone enjoys making tapes of Lps, and likes the sound, then i say enjoy the tapes. if someone enjoys making digital copies of Lps and likes the sound, then i say enjoy the digital. OTOH if someone says either of these approaches make perfect copies, then i say that is wrong. i'm not critical of either approach, just of a miss-leading statement regarding them. i like to hear music in all formats, as close to the native source of the recording as possible.

Mike,

Im not going to get any further into a contest of what I cannot hear, which is a difference between my sources and my recordings, or that of those that I frequently talk with, of the same opinion. But I will say, Im not running any crud machines from the 1970's. Im using 2 deskc from the latter 1990's, and 2 decks from the middle 1980's, and of them, all 4 decks have been completely brought up to better than factory spec, by an expert in this field, of repair and restoration. A guy who I referred many people, and all have had nothing but the most positive to say about his work. I switch between source and tape, I also have DBX type 1, which on occasion I use, and I cannot hear a difference, which is all that is important to me. And to all others that are impressed when I allow them to hear these tapes. I like to agree with you on the fact that we both love reel to reel tapes, and Id rather not argue. My ears are my guide, and they hear just what Im telling you. Ray

It sounds to me like you two guys should make a tape and swap with each other, and let the chips fall where they may!!!

jsman

Im not really arguing with Mike. He is right. From a technical standpoint, the absolute original source, or master tape, will always be better than any generation copy of it. But if that is what your paying $300.00 a reel for, than you should expect that. What Im saying is, the copy that I make on any one of my machines, sounds just as good as the source Im using to my ears, and the ears of many of my fellow reelers. And thats all that is important to me. I am not measuring the results with sensitive test equipment, Im listening to it via my stereo, which is pretty top notch, luckily, since I put alot of it together before children were born. I could never do it now. So, I enjoy my perfect to my ears sound, and enjoy the expressions of fellow audiophiles when I play things for them, or make them recordings. None of us are using test equipment to evaluate any difference between my source material, and the tape of it that I made. Ray