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Our home system: How good it is?

My music sound philosophy/reference is the live music/event that unfortunately I can’t mimic on my system or in any other audio system that I heard. I always say that the very best we can achieve is to be nearer to the recording and even this target is a little “ elusive “ to get for say the least.

Through my audio life I heard a lot of different audio systems: I heard it on audio shows, on dealer rooms and on home people’s systems.

With out any doubt the best audio system performances that I already experienced were/are on home systems where I learn several subjects ( including the people music sound priorities ) and one-two of them are the in deep care in the SET UP of each link on the whole audio chain ( including room ). Some of high price systems that I heard it are not very good because its “ lesser “ care on the each link SET UP.

I want to share with all of you my latest experiences that I had 2-3 weeks ago when I visit some audio friends on USA.
I was exposed to 7 different home systems and I share with you my thoughts on only 4 of those home audio systems that I consider have nothing less but top/first rate performance and where I really enjoy the music.

First than all I want to say that all those audio friends were very gentle and with a very high sense on hospitality: thank you in deep to every one for that I really appreciate it in every way including your very value time that you take/give me.

The best subject during my visit to each one of those great people was to know/meet them: meet people with an in deep knowledge on music ( music lovers more than hardware lovers.), with in deep audio experiences, with in deep know how on their each priorities, with in deep care on whole room-system SET UP, with a great software, with an open mind to share and to accept different points of view, with in deep understanding that there are no perfect systems, with a “ humility “ attitude that it is a must to have to grow-up and with the enjoy “ feeling “ of music listening.

This was a very rare opportunity that I enjoy it and that I know I was so lucky about: Thank you again to all of you!!!!

In no order of preference here it is:

HOUSTON: Fred’s place with a dedicated audio room. Acapella big Triolon speakers, Einstein front end electronics, Rockport/Titan i analog rig, Nordost, JC-1s amps, etc.

When the first music note comes from this system you know that it is something special and after a few minutes you forgot about the hardware and start to enjoy fully the software ( either analog/digital ).
The system is so easy to transmit the music “ feelings/emotions “ and let that the sound/music flow directly to your mind.

Those Triorlon are really great and my hat off to Acapella people because they blend three different speaker drivers in an almost perfect mix. I don’t like ( but the immediacy ) horns ( I heard many of them ) and the Triorlon’s has two of them in the midrange frequency range and I have to say that these horns are the lower horn-signature that I ever heard, the mid bass/bass are moving coil drivers and the Plasma tweeter is ( probably ) the speaker star but with out saying “ I’m here “, like I say almost perfect driver blend.

BOISE: Steve’s place with a dedicated audio room. MBL 111 speakers, custom made Berning’s monoblock amplifiers, Technics SP10 MK3 with a Steve self design/build gorgeous plinth with Schroeder Reference tonearm and strain gauge cartridge/front end by Soundsmith and Lyra Olimpos.

This was my three time that I heard MBL speakers and my first time on a home system: what a difference!!!!, these system/speakers are so near the real music that, like in Fred’s system, the only think that you want is to hear music and more music: LP after LP and again!!!!

Those custom made amplifiers are very good match to the MBL’s and has the lower coloration of tube-signature amplifier I ever heard. I know that the MBL speakers are not easy/friendly with tube electronics and in this system everything is on target, of course that Steve’s hand on this count a lot for that.

I experienced here two different quality performance sound: the Soundsmith one ( that is good ) and a MC cartridge one. I have to say that the Soundsmith rig was only 20-30 hours from new and even Steve was “ playing “ with the set-up. Anyway IMHO that day the Lyra quality performance was way better and I enjoy it for many hours. With this MC cartridge things ( great things ) come out specially the non-sense audio system: disappear!, I had only the LP music performance: great performances.

DALLAS: Louis’s place with a dedicated audio room. Kharma Exquisite 1A speakers, CAT’s monobloks ( new ones: 30 hours on it. ), Lamm/Aesthetix front end electronics, Garrad 301/Triplanar/Xv-1and Technics SP-10MK3/SME/Air Tight both with a custom made wood plinths and the 301 with a custom made power supply.

First thing you note at Loui’s place is that huge room, the biggest I ever know ( maybe 2.3 times the Steve or Fred ones that are big. ) in a home stereo system.

Here I think that the stars are those 550 pound each speakers and its room good integration ( not an easy task ). Like the other systems this one is different but really good. This is my second time hearing Kharma speakers and I have to say that are very very good performers.

The whole sound is a refined/sophisticated one where you or anyone are asking for more, not more quality but more time to heard/hear and enjoy music. I was surprised by the 301 rig quality performance ( where I know very well the XV-1 quality. ): first rate, I can’t hear any coloration that I can/could say: “ that’s was the 301 “.

As good as I heard that system Louis told me that through his Lamm amplifiers ( SE 15-18 watts ) the quality of the system’s sound is a step higher!!, unfortunately I can’t hear it with these amplifiers. Anyway a pleasure to hear it on the Cats.

SAN DIEGO: Mark’s place with out a dedicated audio room ( the system belongs to the sitting room ). Revel speakers, Threshold amplifier, Hovland front end electronics and Raven/Triplanar/Ruby 2.

It seems the “ modest “ system on the group but a top quality performer where we know immediately the very hard work that Mark made to achieve that high quality performance. I know very well the Ruby 2 and in this system is something to hear.
Here there is no single “ star “ but a very good set up of audio items group that sounds a lot better that some very high price systems that I heard, money means nothing at all with out whole/overall knowledge.

As different as are all these audio system all them share common things: system whole synergy, when you heard it you know everything is there ( soundstage, good tonal balance, inner detail, transparent, fast response, dynamics, etc, etc, ), nothing is telling you “ I’m here “ ( very well balance ), sounds good with different kind of music and at different SPL levels, you can heard it for many hours and enjoy every minute, etc, etc.

Are these audio system “ perfect “ ?, certainly not: nothing is. Their owners ( all of them ) already know that they have “ land “ to improve and more important that this fact is that all them know where to improve.

Something to “ ask “ to these systems?, well as you know I’m for full range ( octave to octave ) audio systems and if I put really exigent then I can say that all these system “ miss “ the last bass octave/half octave. This bass octave is system/room dependent and speaker design specification dependent: non of those speakers were designed to achieve that low bass frequency range with the same high quality of the other frequency ranges.
Anyway I can say that I never feel the necessity of that bass octave during all those many hours of music pleasure hearing all those audio systems.

It is a nice thing to learn, through other home audio system listening experiences, if what we have at home is in the right “ road “ and this fact help all of us to grow up in the quest of home audio music sound reproduction heaven.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
Ag insider logo xs@2xrauliruegas
dgob
848 posts
 
Dear Raul,

Too true. My post-Audiogon move from valve amplification to solid state probably marks a full reappraisal of my listening habits and expectations. I'm now very happy to listen to the closest proximity to live music that my imagination can currently picture. Would I change it for any other or more expensive system? Well, as far as my phono and line preamp, cartridges, cabling, satellites and subs are concerned, definitely "NO" - but I wouldn't mind swapping listening rooms with one or two notable Agoners!8>)
Ag insider logo xs@2x
rauliruegas OP
13,097 posts
 
Dear Dgob: I like you always learn through Agon, great place with in deep knowledge people in almost any audio topic!!! and yes there are many " notable " and very expensive home audio systems out there.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.
Ag insider logo xs@2x
rauliruegas OP
13,097 posts
 
Dear friends: How good is your system? IMHO is a wide " open door " to re-think about and try to improve our home audio system.

Obviously there are endless form to improve our system and that is not the subject here but more what to take in count to evaluate what we have, there are no limitations or absolute answers to make it, as all we know everything is relative. I would try to be nly in an enunciative way somethings that could help us when we want to evaluate what we have:

first than all to be un-biased in our system performance like if we are evaluating a friend's system and not ours.

always help to have in deep experiences on music live events ( any kind ) as experiences on other home audio systems ( any kind ), so attend to both " places " as much you can.

choose 5-6 different recordings ( LPs ) that not only you know very well but that can tell you about the quality performance of your systems in different sound reproduction areas: different frequency response ranges, timbre, tonal balance, dynamic, trasients, etc, etc.
Bring with you some of this recording or ask for it every time you hear other systems.

Be consistent about these LPs using it always and only and change any one or add other one if you find something really better. Remember one thing, all these tests LPs that you choose are the ones to use to evaluate it does not matters if the " music " in the LP is not one of your favorities.

try to be relaxed and in good mood when evaluate any system or system's changes. Don't try to evaluate nothing if you are or feel tired.

choose the best day hour to make evaluation's systems , example: when the overall noise floor is lower.

try not to go in a serious system evaluation when there is other person in your room system, always try to be alone.

try to have one or two audio friends that you trust because they are experienced ones and that will tell you what they hear in an un-biased way and not what you want to hear from them, you need honest evaluations/answers not friendly ones.

almost all audio systems have a very short SPL range where performs at its best, try to find the one for your system and the right SPL on each of those LPs that you choose like your evaluation recordings. Sometimes differences of 1db in SPL make " the difference ".

how good is the system at low SPL? how much low?

I think that on the thread and for what some people posted the seat position already be clear as the near field position system and the kind of chair ( free space body surrounded ).

try to find some good CD recordings ( the same recording tyou are using on the LPs ) to compare/evaluate the bass/midrange range, specially the low bass.

every frequency range is important when we are making system evaluuation but it help to concentrate first on both frequency extremes, normally when both are on target the system is ok. overall.

sometimes help to hear how its sounds off axis where normally you can's hear the standing waves that put veils on the system performance.

if you have headphones ( good ones ) use them and compare the differences you hear with and with out.. This could help to find which kind and where room treatment need and for many other things.

don't stop to make changes in your system only because other people had bad experinces about or because the changes go against audio theory/myths or reviewers opinion, try it and give time to those changes to settle down.

time to time check the screws on the loudspekers drivers and thigt it if necessary.

time to time too clean all your system connectors and check that the connection is tight specially the cartridge/tonearm/headshell wires.

be sure that your system is grounded at only one point: usually at the phonolinepreamp where every item in the audio system is connected through.

try to check each channel gain. output impedance and frequency response on the electronics and speakers , it must be even in both channels.

choose the best trade offs according your priorities on sound reproduction and remember that nothing is perfect.

try to lower overall system distortions, any kind.

OPEN MIND attitude, think that everything always can be improved including what you have.

Well there are many other subjects about but IMHO these ones can/could help to any one.

Try to remember that one of the main " name of the game " at audio hardware level are: accuracy and distortion free system performance.

Try to remember too that the only way to beat what we have is through three simple steps: Learn, Learn and Learn, from anybody every single day!!!!, be humilty: IMHO no one knows everything on audio.

Regards and enjoy the music.

Raul.
learsfool
1,215 posts
 
This is a great thread - thanks very much Raul. I have learned a great deal on this site, and will continue to seek more knowledge always - it is a never ending quest.

I would heartily agree that far too many "audiophiles" get way too caught up in their own systems and lose all sense of what live music actually sounds like. I am fortunate enough to be employed full time playing in a major symphony orchestra in a great concert hall, so I hear it almost every day. I would also agree that a very big component in all of this is one's "musical ear." The more you train your ears, the more you will enjoy music, however you are listening to it. It pains me when I go into an audio store, and the dealer quite obviously has no real ear for the music. Or when I read things posted by a dealer or engineer arguing for this or that component purely on the basis of its specs or type or whatever it may be EXCEPT how it sounds. Playing with equipment is fun, but it's all about the music in the end - music is what makes this hobby possible.
jimjoyce25
215 posts
 
Learsfool: Where do you sit in the orchestra? Do you think this makes a difference in your ear?

The reason I ask is this: I once knew a dealer who was a violinist. He was quite convinced that he knew what music should sound like, but his systems were all dramatically devoid of bass. I think it's because he was accustomed to hearing music surrounded by other violinists, and he lacked a sense of overall tonal balance.
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