Antiskating .... The last analog secret

So, the final conclusion is: set the AS as low as possible? Could you give an example? I have the SPU 85 Anniversary at 3.7 gr tracking force in a Fidelity Research FR-66S, the AS should be half of that or less?

Chris

Dazz, if this thread has any point to make at all, it's that there ARE parameters for setting AS -- no the sky is NOT the limit (in either direction;-)

In the case of your SPU-85, an elliptical stylus + high VTF (3.5 g) = lots of friction! The compliance of the suspension is 8x (medium) so I'd be inclined to say that you could BEGIN (in this rare instance) by using the old "AS = VTF" standard. And then slowly reduce the AS until you begin to get some high frequency fuzz as Doug just described. Where you wind up will have to be your decision, of course. Patience is mandatory (patience, and a little self-confidence ;-)

I agree with Doug. I tried nearly every setting from AS to no AS. Yes, no AS is definitely different, but in my opinion only "better in the first minute". I am back with AS, but as little as possible in combination with looking what movement the needle is going to do.
To the bearing:
Yes, of course this can happen, when the bearing is too stiff, but this is rare. Another idea is, that the manufacturer delivered a cartridge which was not aligned properly (that is not common, but possible), but in general - and this is the reason why I started this thread - is to realize or to start a discussion about Antiskating. It can be a serious factor in the personal set up

Dear Thomasheisig: +++++ " What do you think? " +++++

that's what you asked on the subject. Well I already posted my experiences about along that in theory we need AS.

The AS subject is so complex that almost any " think " is valid.
There are to many parameters involve on the AS subject that makes so complicated to have the right scientific answer.

In our ( my self ) today tonearm design we are trying about and we don't have the right answer yet and maybe we can't have it.
From my point of view the AS subject is a whole/big complicated project ( a scietific one ) by itself and I'm not sure if it is worth to go seriously in deep about even that I'm a " perfectionist " on the sound reproduction targets.

I don't want to go inside of the different " roads " ( posted here ) to set-up the AS because IMHO no one is perfect and no one is even near the " target ", almost all are to " simple " for say the least.

In the AS subject we have to take in count between other parameters/things that affects it: eccentricity of the LP that it is different on each LP, deformation/waves on the LP that is/are different on each LP, the recording velocity on each track and the different " velocities " on each track!!!!!!, the differences on 33rpm, 45rpm and 78rpm that affects in different way to the AS subject, each cartridge suspension/compliance/stylus design, each tonearm whole design, VTA/SRA, VTF level, Azymuth, temperature that affects the cartridge compliance suspension, AS tonearm method, etc, etc.

Due to that complexity and over the time I go from full AS to 50%, to 30% to 20% to none.

Am I satisfied?, certainly not, so what to do?.
I make/take a " reference "/status: to set-up/mantain with almost CERO tolerance all cartridge/tonearm/TT set-up standards ( VTA/SRA/VTF (near the high limit )/overhang/etc, etc ) and try 50-30-20-none AS values trying to hear degradations or improvements on the quality performance and after many testings TODAY I choose not to worry ( in my system )
on AS or maybe 20% to stay on " mind-calm ".

Now, there are two important things on the whole AS subject: the cartridge quality control and the tonearm quality control on each cartridge/tonearm out there, IMHO the necessity of more/less AS ( other that the whole set-up ) depends on that high/low cartridge/tonearm build quality control.

Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

Upon further review "Slow is better", "A little bit goes a long way". These jingles have to be inserted into your arm cartridge adjustment log.

I have also returned to slight AS making the smallest moves possible. Also slight moves to VTF and VTA. The graph in the Vacuum State cartridge setup paper opened my eyes up to the possibility of missing the sweet spot of adjustment by making to large of a move. I'm using one no.8 brass washer as the weight for AS for now and its all the way back on the lever.

No doubt that it could be very easy to miss better sound by making to large of a move. This is a tedious time consuming task but will pay huge musical enjoyment. After 5 hrs of tuning last night i most certainly brought better focus, micro detail, to my rig.

This is just the beginning as i am on the hunt and will get my arm cartridge to the best position for superior sound. This is going to be my New Years resolution.